Tire talk

[DomOfTheDead]

How about some analytical rotation?
758 miles since last rotation
5 tyre rotation including spare, trying to include traditional rotation pattern with special accomodations to excessive wear patterns

1. Passenger front move to driver front: reversing rotation direction to balance wear on left side, sharp feathered edge of lug


2. Pass rear to pass front: even wear with minor chunking from auto locker, move forward to promote heavy, even wear

3. Spare move to pass rear: even wear on lugs, rotation direction to lightly feathered edge on left side of lugs

4. Driver rear to spare: heavy chunking on rotation \ left side of lugs due to auto locker, time for a brief rest


5. Driver front to driver rear: even wear, move to rear for some auto locker abuse

 

[Corbet]

My longtime pattern is as follows

Spare > right rear
Right rear > left front
Left front > right front
Right front > left rear
Left rear > spare

This way every tire changes rotational direction every tire rotation. And they all spend equal time front and back.

 

[allen.wrench]

Gnarly man. Have you tried tires with a significantly different tread pattern to see if the wear pattern plays out the same way?

Also, I'm assuming you've weighed your truck. Like you know the weight on the front & rear axles separately. Did you do the load calcs based on max tire load at max pressure?

Idk. Just tossing out ideas to help narrow down variables.

Allen

 

[DomOfTheDead]

Gnarly man. Have you tried tires with a significantly different tread pattern to see if the wear pattern plays out the same way?

Also, I'm assuming you've weighed your truck. Like you know the weight on the front & rear axles separately. Did you do the load calcs based on max tire load at max pressure?

Idk. Just tossing out ideas to help narrow down variables.

Allen

Wear pattern is similar with other tread designs and compounds, mostly due to the locker and hard usage. I'm not upset about it, just mitigating damage

But no, never weighed it, just educated guessing. My heavy wear comment was referring to typical front tire wear patterns from the weight of the engine and steering

 

[allen.wrench]

Makes sense. Give me a few days maybe. I need to unpack a few things from "moving". Then I'll post an easy spreadsheet to calc out tire pressure based on axle weights for max load at max pressure.

Chances are educated guessing is good enough but I'm also happy to play with numbers. Go ahead you can call me a nerd. You know I like it

Allen

 

[Cruisertrash]

Wear pattern is similar with other tread designs and compounds, mostly due to the locker and hard usage. I'm not upset about it, just mitigating damage

But no, never weighed it, just educated guessing. My heavy wear comment was referring to typical front tire wear patterns from the weight of the engine and steering

Is there more wear from engine weight and turning scrub on the fronts? Or - in a part-time 4wd truck like my 60 - on the rear tires from being rear wheel drive the majority of the time?

 

[DomOfTheDead]

Is there more wear from engine weight and turning scrub on the fronts? Or - in a part-time 4wd truck like my 60 - on the rear tires from being rear wheel drive the majority of the time?

I still run drive flanges and FT4wd, so the fronts see more typical wear (even load across the lugs) but the rear tires experience more chunking and harshness from the auto locker. So in essence, I use the weight of the engine to counterbalance and smooth out excessive wear when the rear tires start getting too beat up. if that makes sense

 

[60wag]

Every vehicle Ive owned has had the fronts wear faster than the rears, both front drive and all wheel drive and my 60s that were rear drive - 95% of the time. Its braking that causes most of the tire wear. The brake pads/shoes back this up. I measure the tread depth of all the tires and when the fronts are measurably thinner than the rears, they get rotated, with a crossover to reverse rotatation to reduce cupping of the tread blocks. The tire with the least tread becomes the spare.

 

[White Stripe]

Looks like offroad tires may be illegal in California now. California approved the nation’s first efficiency standard for replacement car tires, forcing new sets sold in the state to match the low rolling resistance of original equipment. Sounds like its to decrease vehicle emissions.

 

[Notyourmomslx450]

Looks like offroad tires may be illegal in California now. California approved the nation’s first efficiency standard for replacement car tires, forcing new sets sold in the state to match the low rolling resistance of original equipment. Sounds like its to decrease vehicle emissions.

It won’t take full effect for a few years and I’m sure there will be some sore of fight back that’ll happen. My friend that lives there said this.

“I don’t believe shit like this will ever evolve. There’s too many politicians that will suffer financially for it to happen. However I’m sure some version of it does happen. Most likely in the form of some sort of luxury tax if you don’t buy their bs tires.”

 

[On the RX]

Kicking around trying something different than the KM series tires and looking for first hand experience.

My thoughts on the KMs, great tire, long life, very strong sidewalks which have never failed even with deep gasses, great in mud for a radial, good in snow, get noisy around 60k miles. I've been running these for years in Ohio mud before moving out here and been running them out here for the last 10 years. They seem to be overkill due to the lack of actual mud in the Rockies, they do work great in the plains mud, but I've only ever driven in that sticky stuff once.

My needs and thoughts: sidewall strength (since I've become so confident from the KMs), good to great in snow, and decent sidewall lugs.
I don't daily drive my 4runner and the KMs I currently have are almost 5 years old. They tend to age out before they wear out and I don't really need something with such a hard compound. I also think that a softer compound will stick better to slickrock.

Current tires being considered:
Toyo R/T Trail
Toyo AT/III
Falken Wildpeak A/T3W
Falken Wildpeak M/T
BFG KO3

Looking for thoughts from first hand experience, someone to punch holes in my choices, other options to consider.

 

[allen.wrench]

Falken Wildpeak M/T

I've been happy with my Wildpeak MTs. I've owned them two years but only put a few thousand miles on them. At the time I got them because they were the best priced for the 33"x10" size I wanted. Mine will likely age out well before wearing out. Around the same time I picked up a set of rims that came with rubber and I've been using those predominantly on street driving. But the several thousand miles I have on the MTs I've been very happy with them. Most of the miles have been driving to and through Moab. They feel similar to K02s.

Tough choice. It might be fine to choose any of them. The performance might be close enough between them, and another factor might be the determining one. Like in my choice I went for the Wildpeak MTs to get the size I wanted for a reasonable price.

Allen

 

[Notyourmomslx450]

View: https://youtu.be/2vrxpTMn47Q?si=ydxrE8zi0Qqz8l8q

 

[Corbet]

Well the general rule is as fuel efficiency goes up traction goes down. I hope they limit their winter efficient tire experiments to Tahoe.

 

[Notyourmomslx450]

Well the general rule is as fuel efficiency goes up traction goes down. I hope they limit their winter efficient tire experiments to Tahoe.

Snow tires are exempt from what i've seen

 

[Corbet]

Snow tires are exempt from what i've seen

I assumed they were, but most Californians don't buy them. I'm making the assumption that all tires that will remain on sale in CA will be pushed harder towards MPG and therefore anyone who drives to the mountains is going to hate them.

When I was buying AT's for my LC250 I asked my local dealer about the Toyo EV AT's. They said don't buy them they are just harder rubber and you'll hate them. I agreed.

 

[Corbet]

Maybe tire manufactures will just give AT tires a deeper tread to get around the rule for now. I’m in favor of that.

 

[allen.wrench]

I'm also happy to play with numbers. Go ahead you can call me a nerd. You know I like it

Like I said I like numbers and maybe it would help others to have a built spreadsheet:

front axle weight (lbf)	2900		front tire max load (lbf)	3100	front tire max pressure (psi)	80
rear axle weight (lbf)	2800		rear tire max load (lbf)	2800	rear tire max pressure (psi)	80
calculated total weight (lbf)	5700		calculated front axle pressure (psi)	37.41935
			calculated rear axle pressure (psi)	40

​

Hopefully the equations paste good. But they might not, so for reference the equations of the spreadsheet are:
Calculated Axle Press = (Tire Max Press/(Tire Max Load*2))*Axle Weight

Nothing revolutionary. What I assembled is generally available in other public places if folks know what to search. I made the spreadsheet so it calculates pressures for different front & rear axles weights, and for different front & rear tire specs.

edit: a few minutes later, I see the table pasted weird. Let me try make it look better. Now the equation is definitely not built into the table, but like I already wrote the equation is just: Calculated Axle Press = (Tire Max Press/(Tire Max Load*2))*Axle Weight. It can be plugged in excel or other spreadsheet software to automagically spit out numbers.

Allen

 

[Corbet]

Who's wheeled regularly on ST or XL rated tires over LT's?

I tow regularly so I've always run LT tires but Bridger's new to him 4Runner could benefit from lighter tires as long as they hold up offroad. What's the thoughts of those who have.

The Mickey Thompson Baja Boss is offered in a "STD" load range but still advertises 16/32" of tread which is more than most in that category and OK even for a LT tire.

 

[allen.wrench]

Half inch of tread you say! Their max load at max pressure tells me the sidewall on them is THICC, BEEFY, and STIFF. Give them a shot!

I'll try pasting a screenshot this time of the spreadsheet calc using your tire @Corbet and I kept the front & rear axle weights constant:


Those specs say ~48# per tire. Mickey T might be playing with how they got the tires registered with the DOT or other Gov authority.

How do LTs of the same size compare in weight?

Allen