Building a Toyota that fits Douglas

[DouglasVB]

@DouglasVB Did you decide what you wanted to use for receiver hitch protection? I have been using the WarFab hitch skid for 3-4 years now. It's a burley piece of metal. I originally purchased from them because they are based out of Montrose. Their prices have gone up, but mine was not powder coated when I bought it many years ago. It does decrease your departure angle because it hangs below the receiver hitch a bit. Its not a deal breaker, and it does what its designed to do. I've been bashing it for years without any issues.

Sheridan Hitch skids

These are being built.for us by AJK who did all our machine work for them prior. These are an in stock item ready to ship. They are powder coated in a standard black finish. We are manufacturing these from 2″x2″ square tube with a 1/4″ wall thickness. We weld our recovery clevis to our...

warfabarmor.com

Edit: Since I purchased from them, it seems their product catalog has grown. They have some cool stuff for Tacomas!

Not yet but that's the one that caught my eye the most!

 

[DouglasVB]

So I guess I need to bob this thing and put on a high clearance bumper 🤣 This was from a fairly mellow stream crossing. Or maybe from crossing a two foot wide straight down cut (several feet deep) from recent rains.

Here's what it looked like where we were. This was a weird dead end county road. The older maps I have show it going through. My best guess is a bunch of roads in the mountains of Monterey county got abandoned by the county 30-50 years ago as a cost savings measure and they reverted to the couple cattle ranchers who own an the land. The county GIS shows this as a dead end but it definitely used to go through. The dead end is at a fence line where there's a patch of BLM land bordering cattle land.

 

[allen.wrench]

Oh yeah. That's an expected responsibility of the hitch. Dragging ass is natural. The hitch is a perfectly acceptable protection for a lot. I was very happy stock.

I transitioned to a "high clearance" steel bumper weld/diy kit from Coastal Offroad only after I tore off each corner. Driver side taken by Fins N Things, and passenger side taken by Hells Revenge.

Allen

 

[DouglasVB]

Oh yeah. That's an expected responsibility of the hitch. Dragging ass is natural. The hitch is a perfectly acceptable protection for a lot. I was very happy stock.

I transitioned to a "high clearance" steel bumper weld/diy kit from Coastal Offroad only after I tore off each corner. Driver side taken by Fins N Things, and passenger side taken by Hells Revenge.

Allen

I'm just surprised at how quickly I dragged the butt of this truck. I guess I'm used to having great approach, departure, and breakover angles of my old 4runner 😅

Hmm if I went with Coastal Offroad I'd finally have to learn how to weld. Maybe that's not a bad thing 🤔

 

[DouglasVB]

Today was productive. I put on the transfer case skid plate, the differential skid plate, the rear shock skid plates, and the bed stiffeners.

This is all RCI stuff.

Lemme tell you... It's not the easiest to install by myself laying on my back under my truck in the driveway. And the bolts are not exactly beefy for these skids. Hopefully they hold up when I take a big hit on a rock.

Still to do are the sliders. I also have a kit to put a 110 volt outlet in the cab.

I need to think about a u bolt flip kit and a different rear spring hanger situation (as I've discussed before on here). And I need a winch. And it would be good to have an on board compressor situation for airing up and down. And I should get a hitch skid and recovery point. Oh yeah and I need to add my amateur radio, GMRS radio, and CB radio at some point. Plus it would be nice to have a forward facing camera and a way to turn both forward and rear on independently of reversing...

Drilling into a perfectly good truck is a bit nerve wracking.

It turned out pretty good.

The transfer case skid plate cross member is not held on very well. I think I'll end up drilling into the frame from the bottom to add another bolt on each side. Currently it's only held in place by one bolt per side. Unless I missed something in the instructions, that's how it's supposed to be. I think it will work well to take a hit but if it got hung up on a rock, it would rip off pretty easily.

This skid is held on by two collars around the axle and a collar around the pinion gear housing. I'm not in love with how it fits and is held in place but it's about the best I've seen without welding on the axle.

These little shock mount skids look like they'll do the job. I've seen people in jeeps absolutely mangle their low hanging shock hangers so I'm hopeful this will prevent that.

 

[DaveInDenver]

@DouglasVB, a couple of things came to mind here.

First is on my truck both the captured nuts on the rear cross member holding the front skid plate stripped. I don't have a belly pan like that so that's the end of the plate on mine so that may change the dynamics. Those are small bolts from the factory because they weren't intended to really do much with the thin splash plate. I put 10mm thread inserts (up from 8mm, pretty sure) in both and have been solid since. I think the problem stemmed from having to crank them down to prevent them from vibrating loose.

Second is you say you're worried and were going to drill new holes, I assume you mean where I indicate "lip" right? The one bolt you mention is on the inside perhaps? I'd think the concern is spreading force so adding a bolt here may help but I'd also think might also just tear, the material in the frame here is pretty thin. Are you thinking of using that hole they provide?

Also, isn't that the transition from boxed to open? Maybe there is enough material there, it's double wall. I'd be concerned with rust, too. Seems to me if you get the fit-up to be a little better so the lip catches the frame better the bolts are mostly just locating, especially once you get sliders on there. There's a factory, well welded cross member right in front of that new one.



This isn't the best photo but @arthog made up a plate on Imelda to protect the belly and carrier. The way we mounted it was to use an 'L' on the frame with a couple of bolts. This worked well and it took a real beating but the bolts did distort the holes, so there was a lot of force on them. Of course the frames on mini truck are thicker and more rigid. The sliders should help with that on the Tacoma but then the material thickness becomes the limit on the frame itself. So I wonder if there's a way to modify and use the sliders in a similar way and transfer force from those lips to them so that the frame doesn't take the punishment.

 

[DouglasVB]

@DouglasVB, a couple of things came to mind here.

First is on my truck both the captured nuts on the rear cross member holding the front skid plate stripped. I don't have a belly pan like that so that's the end of the plate on mine so that may change the dynamics. Those are small bolts from the factory because they weren't intended to really do much with the think splash plate. I put 10mm thread inserts (up from 8mm) in both and have been solid since. I think the problem stemmed from having to crank them down to prevent them from vibrating loose.

Second is you say you're worried and were going to drill new holes, I assume you mean where I indicate "lip" right? The one bolt you mention is on the inside perhaps? I'd think the concern is spreading force so adding a bolt here may help but I'd also think might also just tear, the material in the frame here is pretty thin.

View attachment 128442

This isn't the best photo but @arthog made up a plate on Imelda to protect the belly and carrier. The way we mounted it was to use an 'L' on the frame with a couple of bolts. This worked well and it took a real beating but the bolts did distort the holes, so there was a lot of force on them. Of course the frames on mini truck are thicker and more rigid. The sliders should help with that on the Tacoma but then the material thickness becomes the limit on the frame itself. So I wonder if there's a way to modify and use the sliders in a similar way and transfer force from those lips to them so that the frame doesn't take the punishment.

View attachment 128443

I feel like the only way to really strengthen the whole truck is to plate the frame. You're right that it's pretty flimsy.

Yes, the lip you indicated is where the added crossmember is located. It's only held on by one small bolt per side. And it doesn't even sit flush against the frame because the holes in the crossmember are slotted. I can push it up onto the frame to be flush but I would snap the bolts tightening them before it actually stays flush. The skid plate is doing most of the heavy lifting keeping things more or less in place.

I like that drive shaft joint skid plate that you made. That's definitely an area that deserves protection.

It feels like the Tacoma is on the verge of being a great platform but lots of design compromises were made. At least I fit in the truck though and my 👸 actually wants to go places with me and the truck 😅

 

[DaveInDenver]

That carrier bearing plate did what I needed but it took a lot of clearance. It was a last minute pre-Rubicon hack with whatever Terry had in the shop. I'd scrape as much dirt and rock on top of it as would be under it... Tucking and doing a flat belly would be 1000x better.

If anything doing a fuel tank skid extension to cross over and under the carrier might make sense. But the fuel tank skids on TRD trucks aren't really connected to anything, they're just the straps on the tank and I think would just make the moment on the arms from the frame longer - snap!. So really it would need to be a whole new cross member.

But in 25 years of driving mini truck with this very same set up it's really not that bad. I don't really wheel very hard and if you're routinely hanging up here you should've bought something with a shorter wheel base instead of a frigate-class XtraCab/Access/Double Cab.

That was a 1/4" plate and end up with an inverted bend. On these trucks I'd make that plate a lot more rigid, more like what RCI did using a boxed profile. Otherwise all you're going to spread the frame rails with a transverse leaf spring.

 

[DouglasVB]

In a few minutes of googling, it doesn't look like anyone makes such a plate or channel or skid. That's a bit surprising. I would think some company would make a bolt in solution 🤔

I'll have to think about who I know out here in Cali with the equipment to make something like that.

It seems like the truck needs a 2-3" body lift so the whole belly can be made flat. Then plate the frame. Then add cross members throughout to stiffen it up. Then replace the transfer case with an Atlas transfer case that can do ultra low. Then linked rear suspension and a bobbed bed, and long travel front with all of the accoutrements. Then it would be a great truck.

 

[DaveInDenver]

In a few minutes of googling, it doesn't look like anyone makes such a plate or channel or skid. That's a bit surprising. I would think some company would make a bolt in solution 🤔

Not really surprising. To be effective it needs to slope from the carrier to rear diff, so you lose a lot of clearance. It hangs you up as much as it protects. I made it bolt on so that I could take it off most of the time since knowing your truck and driving the tires over stuff rather than trying to straddle works better, e.g. build up experience and skill so you don't have to rely on pounding skid plates all the time. On IFS the front skid and right under the front diff get beat because they dive to the ground when the suspension cycles, nothing you can do about that. But everything else is up to you.

I'll have to think about who I know out here in Cali with the equipment to make something like that.

It seems like the truck needs a 2-3" body lift so the whole belly can be made flat. Then plate the frame. Then add cross members throughout to stiffen it up. Then replace the transfer case with an Atlas transfer case that can do ultra low. Then linked rear suspension and a bobbed bed, and long travel front with all of the accoutrements. Then it would be a great truck.

Yeah and then you'd be 500 lbs over weight before you even put in camping gear. I decided against anything more than a good IFS skid, bumpers and a winch because as it was I'd already nearly hit GVWR. I do have some dents in the transmission cross member but nothing too bad and the plastic gas tank barely has scratches in it.

I think a lot of this is "what if" rather than "actually need" unless you're trying to 8+ trails all the time. But if that's your intention you need to bob the bed, SAS, double case. You punt the carrier anyway and clock the t-case, move the belly cross member back. A good plate under the t-case is all you need then.

At some point it's not a camping truck that can do some wheeling but a wheeler that you can squeeze in a lunch box and rain coat.

 

[DouglasVB]

I got lazy and used the bobcat skid steer snow blower to dig out my truck 😅 That was preceded with being lazy and not airing down or chaining up to begin with when I started bashing snow drifts to get into my parents place.

I miss having a front locker. And why does it take so long to engage low range and the rear locker?!

 

[DouglasVB]

I installed the Guild Outfitters inverter kit today that allows the OEM inverter to run at 400 watts all of the time. I was hoping it would keep the push button on the dash working where I can select 100 or 400 watts but it appears, after installing the kit, that it's permanently at 400 watts. Based on everything I've read, that's not a big deal. It still requires the key to be in the on position to operate.

I installed a plug in the back of the center console as well so that I can charge things on 120v in the cab and in the bed. Interestingly, the green light on the plug does not illuminate when the power is on. Nor does it illuminate when there is something plugged in. But it does work.

Here are a couple pictures of the install.

Tomorrow if I feel up to it, I'm going to finally install the sliders on the truck. I was out of the country the last two weeks for work and just got back yesterday after my flight to SFO got diverted to Tokyo due to an unruly passenger which made us four hours late. So I'm a bit too tired to tackle the sliders today.

 

[DouglasVB]

I got the sliders on today. The driver's side was a PITA. That side took five hours. The passenger side took less than two hours. The secret is to extend a 16mm wrench to about two feet and use duct tape to hold the bolt and big washer on while pushing it through the two forward holes in the frame. You've also gotta move all the brake lines out of the way. The installation instructions wanted the nut on the inside of the boxed frame for those two forward bolts but no way would that have been possible or reasonable unless you've got scarecrow arms and tiny hands.

These sliders will do fine until someday I weld some sliders on instead. Maybe someday when I fully box the frame and link the rear suspension...

Finished product.

The two bolts at the top of this bracket are the horrible ones to install -- especially on the driver's side. If I was grading a student's design engineering work, I would give this a D+ due to extremely poor assemblability. Yes, the design is easy to produce but wow does it suck to install.

Lots of bolts.

I used a transmission jack to position the sliders for installation.

Before all the fun began 😅

It's taken me about five weekends to install all of the RCI armor that I bought over the holidays. I'm not sure I would DIY again considering what a PITA it was to install most of it. I understand the limitations of bolt on stuff but dang. What a pain.

Next I need to decide on a winch, figure out if I need to strengthen the front bumper assembly, look to see if there's anything else I should do on the front (the two side wing things sticking out from the front frame cross member in particular seem odd), figure out an onboard air situation (probably cut in the missing drivers side bed pocket and put a compressor and tank there), figure out where to mount some amateur, GMRS, CB, and other radios inside the cab and for the antennas, get a U bolt flip kit, and get better spring hangers. Oh and the hitch skid.

But as it is, it should be good to go for most of the stuff I want to do this summer. I can bring a scuba tank to fill tires. The winch would be a nice safety margin.

 

[allen.wrench]

Nice job.

From talking with John, the Comeup rep, at this year's Cruise Moab Vendor night I'd go for a SealSlim Comeup winch over a Warn. 1.5 times pulling ability above the weight of the vehicle is also what I'd aim for. Superwinch ain't bad, at the same time I saw how well the Comeup design is and to avoid wasting time researching on the Internet without real life experience, I decided for myself to choose Comeup when I get to that stage. Since my truck has been getting thiccer over the years, it'd go for the 12k option. And definitely reinforce the attachment points so it's more than just the 4 bolts at the front of the frame attaching the bumper/winch assembly.

From a couple classes with Bill Burke, my goal is to get a front bumper with the best winch visibility possible. As far as I've seen on the interwebs most 3rd gen Taco front bumpers hide the winch. I used Coastal Offroad rear bumper kit that I welded together, it saved me some moneys (I'd estimate saved $500-800). It also gave me the chance to understand and then change the design to make it better per my engineering strength estimates. Based on that experience I'm likely to also buy the Coastal Offroad front bumper kit and modify its design for the best possible winch visibility and frame attachment. Not getting the extreme high clearance option since I have yet to actually need more clearance than the stock bumper and it's a lot of work to change the frame.

I didn't realize the bed inverter could be made to put provide 400 watts continuous. Do you know if is it a legit constant 400 watt inverter (with like 800 watt peak) that Toyota figured is best to sometimes provide 100 watt option to save battery, alternator, or something else? I mean is the inverter and supporting hardware (i.e. the 12v power cable) meant to provide 400 watts continuous?

What did you install for the center console inverter?

Allen

 

[DouglasVB]

I didn't realize the bed inverter could be made to put provide 400 watts continuous. Do you know if is it a legit constant 400 watt inverter (with like 800 watt peak) that Toyota figured is best to sometimes provide 100 watt option to save battery, alternator, or something else? I mean is the inverter and supporting hardware (i.e. the 12v power cable) meant to provide 400 watts continuous?

The way the OEM inverter works, it is in 100w mode when the engine is on and the vehicle is NOT in park. It only goes to 400w mode when the vehicle is in park, the engine is on, and you push the inverter button on the dash. Then it will happily do 400w. I think they lock out the 400w mode while you drive to keep it from using too much energy in case you're running accessories and whatnot? I'm not really sure why. The forum posts I've seen about it online all indicate that it's overly cautious to do that and people successfully modify the system to run at 400w all the time without issue.

The kit I installed has it always at 400w but I think I'll modify it so that I can select between 100w and 400w. Not because it really matters but because I like options.

What did you install for the center console inverter?

The OEM inverter is located under the center console.

From talking with John, the Comeup rep, at this year's Cruise Moab Vendor night I'd go for a SealSlim Comeup winch over a Warn. 1.5 times pulling ability above the weight of the vehicle is also what I'd aim for. Superwinch ain't bad, at the same time I saw how well the Comeup design is and to avoid wasting time researching on the Internet without real life experience, I decided for myself to choose Comeup when I get to that stage. Since my truck has been getting thiccer over the years, it'd go for the 12k option. And definitely reinforce the attachment points so it's more than just the 4 bolts at the front of the frame attaching the bumper/winch assembly.

On my old 4runner, I had a 12k harbor freight winch which worked surprisingly well even with me neglecting it. I think I'll go for another 12k winch but probably not harbor freight. I do want synthetic this time instead of steel line.

I'm not trying to be quite so budget conscious as using a harbor freight winch this time around but I don't want to be completely Gucci either 😅

From a couple classes with Bill Burke, my goal is to get a front bumper with the best winch visibility possible. As far as I've seen on the interwebs most 3rd gen Taco front bumpers hide the winch. I used Coastal Offroad rear bumper kit that I welded together, it saved me some moneys (I'd estimate saved $500-800). It also gave me the chance to understand and then change the design to make it better per my engineering strength estimates. Based on that experience I'm likely to also buy the Coastal Offroad front bumper kit and modify its design for the best possible winch visibility and frame attachment. Not getting the extreme high clearance option since I have yet to actually need more clearance than the stock bumper and it's a lot of work to change the frame.

In an earlier post I think I linked to the bumper the truck came with. It's a low profile thing where the winch area is hidden in the bumper. I need to look at it more closely to see how I can install and access a winch. It's got the mounting points so it's possible but it'll be a bit of a pain. Eventually I do want a high clearance front (and rear) bumper. I don't know how to weld, don't have welding equipment, and don't really have anywhere that I can weld so a DIY bumper is probably out of the question without some significant effort. But at some point I'll probably need to bite that bullet and do some welding to give myself much more approach angle. There's a lot of low hanging junk up front that could be deleted and a better solution could be welded in place.

Initially though I'm going to stick with the bumper the previous owner installed. It's a mellow solution to get started for now.

Then maybe next year I'll go more wild with my bumpers 😅

 

[DaveInDenver]

The logic I think for the 100W/400W selection is just to prevent a large load on the alternator. With the engine off you're just draining the battery so the limit is simply how deep you want to draw it down. But running if you do consume the 400W you'll be using about 35A from the 12V side. If this is winter perhaps, all lights on, cabin fan on high, wipers running. At idle you could presumably use more energy than you're generating.

So I think it's just a way for Toyota to avoid getting complaints about people's headlights dimming or surging. That's something you haven't seen in a new car since a 1996 Kia. It's probably a calculated bet that while driving you won't need the full 400W. What are you likely to run from it in most scenarios? A tablet charger for kids watching videos or something. Stopped you'd probably be using tool battery chargers or laptops or lights.

I also do think wire sizing and duty cycle may factor in. They fused the circuit at 100A, though, so the wire must be pretty decent weight. I don't know to be honest, I have only ever used the inverter once to test something I was buying on Craigslist I think. It's got a lousy waveform and 400W isn't super useful.

To me I think what is potentially the best thing is Toyota saw fit to run a 100A circuit into the cabin perfect for reuse with lots of radios!

 

[DouglasVB]

The logic I think for the 100W/400W selection is just to prevent a large load on the alternator. With the engine off you're just draining the battery so the limit is simply how deep you want to draw it down. But running if you do consume the 400W you'll be using about 35A from the 12V side. If this is winter perhaps, all lights on, cabin fan on high, wipers running. At idle you could presumably use more energy than you're generating. So I think it's just a way for Toyota to avoid getting complaints about people's headlights dimming or surging. That's something you haven't seen in a new car since a 1996 Kia.

The weird thing is, in stock form, the inverter will only do 400 watts when the truck is running and in park. Otherwise with the brake off, it only allows the inverter to operate in 100 watt mode. 🤷‍♀️

 

[DaveInDenver]

The weird thing is, in stock form, the inverter will only do 400 watts when the truck is running and in park. Otherwise with the brake off, it only allows the inverter to operate in 100 watt mode. 🤷‍♀️

Right, OK. That actually makes the most sense. I thought it was 100W with ignition on, 400W with it off. But max with engine running but not moving is completely logical and I guess with key off the inverter goes off, too.

Some of this could be duty cycle on the inverter itself, too. You might make the argument that while driving the inside of the cab will be its most warm and where it's hidden under the console might get too hot if you run continuously at 400W for long periods while driving.

 

[allen.wrench]

Oh wait. This morning when I read and replied I thought you were talking about the truck bed inverter. My 2017 Tacoma only has a 100/400W inverter in the bed. It's making more sense now that you're talking about an inverter inside the cab.

Gotcha about that bumper. I now remember you did mention the low-profile front bumper, but only now after your reminder, lol. That is fair enough to use what you have. I mean I still have my stock front bumper ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Good point about the Harbor Freight winch. I have heard from a few folks it does a good job and seems to be about 1/2 the price of Comeup. Now that I think about it, I should have asked John if he had an opinion about HF winch construction. I'd definitely go for synthetic line regardless the winch brand.

Allen

 

[DaveInDenver]

@allen.wrench we are talking about the same thing. The inverter for these truck is located under the console but the outlet is in the bed. That's the way it is on my 2008. The reason for this is so they could avoid running heavy wires the whole length of the truck I assume. What year is your truck and is it different?