Oil and Coolant Mixing

[DaveInDenver]

Didn't sleep much. Seems more today like the thing to do is call Mike Goodnight and see if it's worth anything to him not running. Probably take the 'Nest off first, though. I have to put the truck back outside Saturday, when my window to work inside closes. I'm hesitant to tear it down any more until I resolve the broken bolt. First thing is to look at that, start soaking in Kroil. My gut is tied in knots thinking about screwing this up even more.

 

[tacomaJoe73]

@DaveInDenver just DMd you via cell.

 

[J Kimmel]

That’s not bad. Lay a nut on it and fill with weld. The heat will help loosen it. I had a couple like that in my cylinder heads and they came right out

 

[DaveInDenver]

That’s not bad. Lay a nut on it and fill with weld. The heat will help loosen it. I had a couple like that in my cylinder heads and they came right out

I hear ya, it seems simple in principle just never done it. I guess I'd be no worse off donating it with a FUBAR'd block. Watch the evening news for a numb nut who blew himself up in his garage tonight.

 

[jps8460]

Welding a nut on typically works. It’s hard to tell the size… looks like 10mm.

This is laborious, but on larger bolts I’ve drilled a tapped a LH 1/4-20 and put a LH GR8 1/4-20 bolt in there to extract.

Once I get the hole drilled n tapped I heat the crap out of it and shock it with PB then send the 1/4-20 with an impact.

 

[DaveInDenver]

They are M12-1.25

It looks small because it's about a mm or so ring where the block and bolt have corroded into homogeneity. I ran over it with a wire tooth brush already. That's why I'm paralyzed. It feels to me like it needs a machinist's attention.

 

[AimCOTaco]

Big and accessible bolt like that, I'd work it with punches and chisels first... you might get lucky with some rust breaking blows and kroil alone... if not you can still drill it or weld nut it. Lots of vibration and blows to break the corrosion and stiction can help a lot. Lets assume the overheating caused some shear stress that lead to the head bolt breaking, maybe she's not fully one with the block iron yet.

One problem after another so just work one thing at at time. I'm imagining Dean laughing along with you here, it's not Saturday yet, keep at it!

This is heartwarming and you're awesome. Cars ARE pain and wrenching just sucks sometimes.

 

[J Kimmel]

I hear ya, it seems simple in principle just never done it. I guess I'd be no worse off donating it with a FUBAR'd block. Watch the evening news for a numb nut who blew himself up in his garage tonight.

If you don’t have access to a welder that’s one thing. Get a nut that will sit on the stud, hold it with vice grips, fill with weld. Focus down onto the broken bolt and let it fill with hot weld. Let it sit for a minute and gently start to turn the nut out. The heat will help loosen the broken bolt. It’s really pretty simple especially with it sitting like that.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Got impatient. Dammit.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Not promising. Haven't figured out nut size, voltage/current and wire speed to get one to hold yet practicing and I'm running out of non-stainless.

 

[RDub]

Keep at it, you’ll get it to weld. A buddy here extracted a rusted in and broken off well below the surface bolt in one the exhaust manifold horns on my 2F. I was sure it was a lost cause, but he kept at it, finally getting it to start turning after about four attempts at welding a nut. With a little gentle back and forth a few times it screwed right out.

 

[DaveInDenver]

I got a couple that I think melted in the full throat of the nut. No love. Frowny face.

For future reference I started at (I think) 18.0V @ 225 ipm (left most) and the last was 18.8V @ 245 ipm (top one). The bottom two were 18.5V and around 230 or 240 ipm, which filled nice. That last one was too fast, it walked up the nut too fast but seems best on the head bolt side, can see the divot it ate in. The first one was a little too slow and cold to fill.

Wonder if the difference in mass is just too great. The nuts are nearly at melt but it doesn't seem to be really biting the head bolt. Thinking grinding in a cone. Maybe tomorrow, I pretty spent and sore. I'm too old for this shit.

The oil is Kroil I sprayed after. I hit things with brake cleaner to get clean metal before burning. I have plain stuff, 25/75 and 0.030 ER70.

I think I see space at the top thread. So.



For completeness, the top side, same order.

 

[IoN6]

Is the oil an addition post-weld? I can read, I promise.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Is the oil an addition post-weld?

Yeah, I spritzed a bit on while it was still hot on that last try.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Made the top of the broken section flat and then put a bit of a cone into it with a Dremel. Then very slowly stepped up drill sizes to achieve a nice 1/4" bore that I'm guessing is about 2/3rd into it.



Easy out that fits about 1/2 way in. Just used what I think is mild pressure but it's very reluctant to give up this fight. I'm not seeing any rotation but can feel flex. Some of that is the easy out biting in I suppose, but...

Ugh.

I'm thinking the left hand bolt thing might be the best path. I don't trust an easy out and if a big one breaks that may be more of a PITA. A broken bolt would be a bummer but that could be drilled out unlike a hardened easy out.

My other thought is to keep going with drilling until I'm closer to the threads. I'm now really curious why this bolt seized. Not sure simple rust would be this tough. Cross threaded? Maybe I wasn't smooth and consistent enough breaking the bolts loose? I did very small twists, took half a dozen tugs to start feeling pressure release. Dunno.

Like @Hulk says, having a partner in crime standing there helps with shared pain and how cavalier you might be. Sometimes you need to be gung-ho, sometimes restraint is the right move...

 

[IoN6]

Might be able to get some more penetration with the hole in it now, if you can get the MIG gun perpendicular and give it a good hot blip or three.

It is like rigid tapping, but in reverse. Major pucker factor each and every time I do it.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Might be able to get some more penetration with the hole in it now, if you can get the MIG gun perpendicular and give it a good hot blip or three.

It is like rigid tapping, but in reverse. Major pucker factor each and every time I do it.

I considered welding again but I'd hate to waste having such a perfect hole. Just look at it. It's magnificent! Never mind it's a little off center. But whatcha gonna do?

 

[DaveInDenver]

Definitely feeling twist in the easy out, like a torsion spring. That's only with the tap handle, too, haven't tried a socket wrench on it.

 

[IoN6]

I considered welding again but I'd hate to waste having such a perfect hole. Just look at it. It's magnificent! Never mind it's a little off center. But whatcha gonna do?

That is quite the magnificent hole in a busted bolt. Think how magnificent it will be/look removed from the block!

 

[DaveInDenver]

That is quite the magnificent hole in a busted bolt. Think how magnificent it will be/look removed from the block!

I just wish it would have started turning out already. It feels to me like I'm putting way more effort on that easy out than I should have to at this point.