What can salt do for you?

[On the RX]

So while I was dismantling my 97 runner I was... well, shocked isn't the right word. Let's just say I was saddened by what I found when I removed all my armor.

My warn 8000 hasn't worked for a year. It was mounted in the bumper and without removal of the bumper I was unable to service it. I am trying to fugure out what is salvagable. Before getting into I think maybe the brushes, if i can get them out. On a side note, the remote is in great shape!

The following is what I found after removal.

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[Corbet]

Wow, that is rough.

 

[On the RX]

I opened up the split housing on the motor and this came out.

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[On the RX]

Something to consider when thinking of a new front bumper. I know I will never buy another bumper that must be removed to service the winch. Optimally I will get a bumper with a 2" insert to slip the winch in and keep it out of the weather unless needed.

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[Corbet]

For the record I have no issues getting my Warn 12K out of my ARB. Simply drops out the bottom.

 

[Cocarlisle]

That's what my rear diff locker actuator looked like under the guard
Horrible stuff

 

[Rezarf]

Ouch, sorry man that is terrible rot.

 

[On the RX]

For the record I have no issues getting my Warn 12K out of my ARB. Simply drops out the bottom.

I feel like the web I had on my 93 was the same way. I went with a schrock works for my 3rd gen. I might get it modified to do just that before I get it painted if I can find the funds.

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[On the RX]

I feel like the web I had on my 93 was the same way. I went with a schrock works for my 3rd gen. I might get it modified to do just that before I get it painted if I can find the funds.

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Web = ARB in auto correct language.

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[Rzeppa]

My 60 was an Arizona truck that had never seen mag chloride when it first came to Colorado in 2010. When I bought it in 2011, it was about the most rust free unrestored Land Cruiser I had ever seen. Now the inside frame rails above the rear axle are completely toast, I need to cut them out and plate the whole thing.

I HATE MAG CHLORIDE!!!!!!

 

[On the RX]

I moved from Ohio and they used sodium chloride from mines under lake Erie. That stuff decimates steel. I heard the mag chloride isn't nearly as bad. From what you say I am wrong. Any suggestions on good undercoating spots?

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[OilHammer]

Salt

It's the chloride part that's a problem. And BTW, they started using traditional salt again this year because it's cheaper.
A tasty article about that crap: https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...9294e6-b949-11e4-aa05-1ce812b3fdd2_story.html

 

[On the RX]

I heard on npr that they were going to start getting NaCl from salt lake area. Super disappointed by this. I thought I got away from that stuff when I moved out here.

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[Rzeppa]

I moved from Ohio and they used sodium chloride from mines under lake Erie. That stuff decimates steel. I heard the mag chloride isn't nearly as bad. From what you say I am wrong. Any suggestions on good undercoating spots?

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Mag Chloride is exactly twice as bad as Sodium Chloride (for rusting our Land Cruisers) from a chemistry standpoint, which is why it is twice as good (for melting ice) as sodium chloride as a road salt. It is more complicated than that but that's the executive summary.

When they switched to mag chloride around here, the utility companies started to see issues with overhead lines disintegrating from the splashback spray they had never seen before.

 

[TacoDane]

Mag Chloride is exactly twice as bad as Sodium Chloride (for rusting our Land Cruisers) from a chemistry standpoint, which is why it is twice as good (for melting ice) as sodium chloride as a road salt. It is more complicated than that but that's the executive summary.

When they switched to mag chloride around here, the utility companies started to see issues with overhead lines disintegrating from the splashback spray they had never seen before.

I've got the compatibility charts in front of me. Most of the chlorides are pretty similar. (I sell chemical pumps and treatment equipment. CDOT is a customer as well and has given me some insight on the equipment). Calcium chloride is the least harmful to most metals but expensive. Mag is really worse on aluminum. Sodium is worse on metals like carbon steel.

No matter the salt, Really the best thing you can do is religiously wash under your truck between storms. Unlike other regions we get that luxury of warmer swings in the winter.

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[SteveH]

State of Colo. report

Therefore, depending on service conditions experienced by automobile components, MgCl2 is more corrosive than NaCl under humid environments, and NaCl is more corrosive under immersion and arid environments. This conclusion was obtained based on the experiments with the deicing salts used in the state of Colorado.

https://www.codot.gov/programs/research/pdfs/2002/magautocor.pdf

 

[On the RX]

Can't they just go back to stone chips? A windshield is so much cheaper than a frame, or body panels or winches (especially when I have 0 deduction on my comprehensive insurance!)?

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[Rzeppa]

Therefore, depending on service conditions experienced by automobile components, MgCl2 is more corrosive than NaCl under humid environments, and NaCl is more corrosive under immersion and arid environments. This conclusion was obtained based on the experiments with the deicing salts used in the state of Colorado.

https://www.codot.gov/programs/research/pdfs/2002/magautocor.pdf

Thanks for the link Steve! Another good quote:

Experimental results obtained by the cyclic exposure test (SAE J2334) on the bare metals
indicated that MgCl2 was more corrosive than NaCl.

And finally:

Statistics showed that road salt costs about $55 per ton, however, it causes about more than $1543/ ton worth of damage to vehicles, bridges, and the environment (Hudson, 1987).

I'd speculate that if mag chloride saved someone's life because it worked better than sodium chloride or nothing at all, then it is worth it might be a refrain, but really, let's fill some damn potholes please?

 

[DaveInDenver]

It's not as simple as saying MgCl is or isn't worse than NaCl because solution concentration, temperature, relative humidity and comparative wetness (e.g. immersed or damp) will tend to change things.

I think those of us who have lived in the Midwest where rock salt is typical and now in Colorado where liquid magnesium chloride has been used for a couple of decades can say based primarily on observation mag chloride is less damaging in real use. It's of course not benign by any stretch but trucks do last longer here than back east.

All the analysis and theory might support this or it might not, but my two eyes tell me their own story. For as much winter weather as we deal with here, particularly we skiers, there's no way you'd see 20 year old trucks in a place like Iowa or Missouri.

I'd defer to Martin, who took a 25 year old always-in-Colorado mini truck to Iowa. How much has the corrosion changed in the past two winters? I was pretty good about washing the truck and it was certainly not rust-free. But it wasn't bad either and I drove the heck out of it in the mountains in the winter, so it got plenty of exposure to mag chloride.

 

[SteveH]

Part of the reason that sand isn't used as much lately is to cut down on the 'brown cloud' and particles in the air. The salt holds moisture and sticks to the sand, and helps control dust, too. The brown cloud factory is also why cities runs street sweepers in the winter after a storm, to gather the sand put on the road during the storm.

You can blame the EPA for a lot of why salt (which isn't great for groundwater quality) has supplanted sand as a (ahem) better environmental choice for ice control.