new Kane Creek development

[nakman]

y'all seen these articles already?

Uproar over Kane Creek development dominates commission meeting - The Times-Independent

Well over 100 people spilled out of the Grand County Commission chambers and into surrounding hallways last night to speak out against a controversial 580-unit development on Kane Creek Boulevard. In an hour and a half of citizen comment, residents decried what they characterized as an...

www.moabtimes.com

Over 100 residents turn out to voice concerns about Kane Creek development plan - Moab Sun News | Moab, Utah

Commissioners, staff express frustration that project stems from a 30-year-old rezoning decision

moabsunnews.com

Appears that work is under way to develop that area just up Kane Creek... residents don't seem too happy about it. And for good reason apparently, can't really deny that it's in a flood plane there, and creating a sewer plant in an area that might get flooded does seem a little half baked kinda.. @Beach Boy the Moab Times article states that they started clearing the area in December... have you seen it? I am guessing this is the exact spot where we had Cruise Moab headquarters that one year... wild.

 

[CardinalFJ60]

modern treatment plants are amazing feats of science. I worked in one in high school...I watched the effluent scientist guy drink a sample of what was being put into the Connecticut River.

 

[nakman]

interesting stuff, Dave... I wonder if anyone downstream of Moab is crying about this... you know Arizona, California, etc. or whomever has those water rights.

 

[Beach Boy]

Have not been out Kane Creek for years. Unfortunately the property is already zoned commercial and have had permits for years, including, yes when we held Cruise Moab out there. The City has little option if the developers follow all the regulations. Can't see it as I am in Florida.

 

[HDavis]

I saw somewhere that they were asking for fill dirt to help bring it out of the flood plain. Unfortunately, if it's zoned for development the developers are going to follow the books for by-right approval and there is not much anyone can do about it.

 

[nakman]

Ok wow, check this out…


View: https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2RR5jkMuU0/?igsh=MWF6ZmN5c3ZrenN6Yw==

 

[HDavis]

Ok wow, check this out…


View: https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2RR5jkMuU0/?igsh=MWF6ZmN5c3ZrenN6Yw==

Thats the post I saw!

 

[Burt88]

They're developing on both sides of Kane Creek road and using the soil from the high side to raise the floodplain to permittable elevation. They're doing all of this to then apply for the actual construction permits. This piecemeal process is such a scam and part of the reason why I didn't pursue being a city planner. Money talks and intelligence walks. Currently the scale of the project isn't supported by any infrastructure and we all know Kane Creek Road is inadequate to support high density "luxury" homes. So this area gets destroyed by developers and then the residents start complaining about the ATV's and trucks all day and the battle between users and residents will never end. And also, the property being developed provides access to Pritchett Canyon so I'm sure that'll be something to fight over in the future.

We are all guilty of participating in a culture so hyper focused on money that every once in a while we get slapped in the face wondering why things like this happen. Money. That's why it happens. You don't need to be smart to be rich. Sometimes you only need to be an a$$hole.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Every time you visit or rent a condo or AirBNB in Moab it's part of it. Cruise Moab is another brick in the wall. So we contribute to the problem and need to figure out how to help fix it. The hard part is we love our places to death and encouraging more use is probably not helping.

 

[Beach Boy]

Moab being "loved to death" is one of the reason I am considering selling my house in Moab and moving elsewhere.

 

[Corbet]

Everywhere in the west is getting loved to death. Simply don’t have the enough parks, trails, ski resorts whatever to handle the demand anymore.

 

[Crash]

Everywhere in the west is getting loved to death. Simply don’t have the enough parks, trails, ski resorts whatever to handle the demand anymore.

Yup, treasure those quiet, private places that someone earlier this year was trying to get everyone to share their secret spots. No thanks.

 

[Johnny Utah]

Secret spots are a treasure for sure. I have a group of buddies that ride dirt bikes together. We hold our “cards close to our chest”. If we don’t know you, you’re going to have to figure it out yourself.
It’s kinda crappy, but with the way of the internet and social media, word moves fast and places can get overrun.

 

[Corbet]

Social Media is surely a large contributor. I quit posting locations of where I go unless really obvious anyway. Even here on the forum.

 

[Cruisertrash]

Social Media is surely a large contributor. I quit posting locations of where I go unless really obvious anyway. Even here on the forum.

There’s kind of a “movement” on social media amongst some car campers & wheelers to never post locations.

I remember learning this hobby circa 2005-2006. My friend’s older brother had a four door Tacoma with a Wildernest that we all thought was as the coolest thing ever. My buddy had a beater single cab first year Tacoma. I still had a Civic so I’d tag along. Right away I could tell that the locations of trails, campsites, and places like mines or cabins were passed on from one person to the next once trust was built. It wasn’t a gatekeeping thing, it was so that those places didn’t get wrecked.

Anyway, the more I read about this Kane Creek thing the weirder it gets. Most of city council seems to not want the development, but there hands are tied. With the zoning changed of that area in the 90s, they tied their own hands. I think the developer can’t even apply for a building permit without the wastewater treatment plant, which they can’t put in until part of the land is above the 100-year floodplain, so they’re taking a huge risk moving an immense amount of dirt to build the plant. Seems incredibly risky. They must see the ROI as huge enough to justify it though. And who’s the target buyer for these places? I know a lot of people would jump at the chance, but it’s nobody I know. I don’t go to Moab for an all-inclusive, luxury resort experience with the occasional guided SxS tour into the hills for an afternoon.

Absolutely wild that this can happen when it seems almost nobody in the town wants it. But hey, with the laws and zoning the way they are, the developer is doing it legally. Sometimes legal things don’t seem to be ethical though. A story as old as time.

 

[Cruisertrash]

Call it a conspiracy theory if you want, but the world - at least our part of it, and probably all it, for all of time - is and has been about money. The people doing big money shit seem to be able to grease the wheels while the rest of us can't. Need a high rise built in Denver but having trouble with zoning and permitting? Wine and dine the mayor and select city council members. Wow, suddenly the property gets rezoned and the permits get greenlit while small business construction companies fight for months or a year to get a permit, severely impacting their cash flow and ability to do business. Need to engage in resource extraction on public land when there's something preventing you from that? Go to Washington and sprinkle some campaign donations around, fly to expensive holiday locations with lawmakers. Wow, suddenly the area is opened up to your extraction endeavor. "Democracy" for who? Certainly not for me, and probably not most of us hanging around a vehicle forum on the web. And amazingly, regular folks still idolize the big money movers and shakers. We're more like each other, and have far less in common with any of them. And yes, I know the United States is technically a republic, let's not be pedantic.

And so here we are in Moab with at least half the city council (or whatever their term for that is) against this Kane Creek development, with lines for the public out the door during city council meetings. Wheeling community notwithstanding, the residents seem to be pretty well united. Of course, that's gleaned from the news reporting I've read on this, I'm sure there are outliers, whether supportive or ambivalent. But when was the last time a city council meeting in Moab had people overflowing out the door to the chambers? A representative form of government doesn't seem to be working out for what looks like a vocal majority there. And it doesn't seem to be working out for the elected representatives either, this seems way bigger than them even.

This isn't the way I'd like to see our municipalities, our country, or the world work, but hey ... buck up, right? That's just how things are. Get over it.

The developer stated in one of these articles that it will take 18 months to move the dirt to build the wastewater treatment plant, something like 50000 dump truck loads. Then they have to build the plant. Then they have to apply for the building permit. That's a long time span. They must be pretty confident they've greased the wheels enough that nothing goes awry before they start pouring foundations for buildings. Makes me wonder if they're living in their own fantasy or they know something we don't. Again, total guess bordering on conspiracy theory. Stranger things have happened though. I'll be sitting here waiting for somebody in Moab to go full-on Edward Abbey.

 

[BritKLR]

conspiracy (noun)

1. the act of conspiring together
2. an agreement among conspirators

Not a theory.

It's an accepted but unspoken truth that greasing the palms of the right people gets things done. It pervades down to the smallest town and counties.

Conspiracy fact.

Your input will be ignored in the order in which it was received.

Struggling bartenders and small restaurant owners elected to Congress becoming millionaires in 2 terms.

Public servants. Yeah, sure. Wink, wink.

Monkywrenching. Indeed.

But it falls on deaf ears. Same people complaining about this development were happy to have the same corrupt system telling you to stay off this trail and get in permit lotteries.

You can't have a little bit compromised government when it suits you, but not when it doesn't.

And it wasn't surely *them* moving there that caused the issue. It's the others who did.

Work a handful Government Criminal Corruption cases and it's hard to have faith in anything they say or do.......

 

[Burt88]

It's no matter if the development actually get's completed. Each phase during construction is financed and salaries are paid to the developers, architects, and engineers and most of the time but not always the companies doing the actual work. If the plug gets pulled they declare bankruptcy and move on to their various other projects. It's all about the money and keeping things moving to get paid without concern for who it affects and what damage is done. The financier keeps the land and either sells it to recoup money, uses the land to back equity usually at an inflated value, or takes a loss which when done strategically can offset taxes on other profits. As long as the market doesn't tank and overleverage the financiers assets the cycle continues. But no matter what happens to any of these large construction projects the people at the helm are paying themselves to stay active and build wherever and as much as they can. Because money

 

[Cruisertrash]

It's no matter if the development actually get's completed. Each phase during construction is financed and salaries are paid to the developers, architects, and engineers and most of the time but not always the companies doing the actual work. If the plug gets pulled they declare bankruptcy and move on to their various other projects. It's all about the money and keeping things moving to get paid without concern for who it affects and what damage is done. The financier keeps the land and either sells it to recoup money, uses the land to back equity usually at an inflated value, or takes a loss which when done strategically can offset taxes on other profits. As long as the market doesn't tank and overleverage the financiers assets the cycle continues. But no matter what happens to any of these large construction projects the people at the helm are paying themselves to stay active and build wherever and as much as they can. Because money

Boom. And in that case, the town gets left holding the bag.

 

[Burt88]

Boom. And in that case, the town gets left holding the bag.

And then, one of the issues faced by the town or county officials regarding zoning, is that any anticipation of something like this by the planning department gets shut out by council and commissioners who are voted into office. Any time preemptive decisions are made that may restrict the potential of a property owner to do as they wish with their land is referred to as "overreach" by the voters. And round and round we go