88 pickup 5 speed stuck in reverse
- Thread starter FJCDan
- Start date
rover67
Rising Sun Member
Have you cracked the line at the output of the cutch master and bled with it open? Once you get some flow there tighten it up and try to bleed the circuit all they way to the slave again
FJCDan
Rising Sun Member
Thanks Mike, I will let you know. I have tomorrow to get one of these rolling, will see.
Tried that doing a bench bleed and then got my wife in there to pump the clutch, no luck. Just can’t get it to fully disengage. Worked on 4Runner to try and figure clunking sound. Going to put up on jack stands and see if I can get it to happen again.
DaveInDenver
Rising Sun Ham Guru
When you bleed fluid is pushed through? Even if there's air in the system it should move the slave piston at least to some point.
You've surely checked the free play. This from the 1988 FSM.
Another thing that comes to mind. You mentioned replacing the clutch. I wonder if you put the friction disk in backwards. Your symptoms are consistent with that.
You are sure the clutch release fork is pivoting and pushing the throw out against the pressure plate? It will have some small play you can feel by hand before you need to be He Man to move.
You've surely checked the free play. This from the 1988 FSM.
Another thing that comes to mind. You mentioned replacing the clutch. I wonder if you put the friction disk in backwards. Your symptoms are consistent with that.
You are sure the clutch release fork is pivoting and pushing the throw out against the pressure plate? It will have some small play you can feel by hand before you need to be He Man to move.
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DaveInDenver
Rising Sun Ham Guru
FWIW I just uploaded the whole section on the 1988 truck clutch.
FJCDan
Rising Sun Member
Thanks Dave the FSM pages. Looks like I have done what it says to do. I will need to check pedal play. disc goes in one way with this side labeled flywheel side. There is movement of the slave cylinder when you push in the pedal and I can move clutch fork till it stops and needs He Man. I have been driving it since I replaced clutch in May and even wheeled it pretty hard on the Spooky night run with no problems.
DaveInDenver
Rising Sun Ham Guru
Interesting.
Sure seem like you're having more trouble than I've ever had with the clutch hydraulics. I also thought maybe you have debris blockage in a line, a flake of rust or dirt or a soft line that's eroded into goo. Or is it possible you dented or kinked a hard line?
Are we sure you can rule out for certain it's inside the transmission yet?
You can move the clutch fork if you spin, brace yourself and go leg press day at the gym. I think it's something like 100 lbs of force.
That's one nice thing about the RA60 in my Taco (and there ain't a lot of things I like about it more than a W56). But it has an inspection plate so you can see inside the bellhousing. That would tell you a lot, that the throwout is good, no pressure plate fingers are broken, etc.
Sure seem like you're having more trouble than I've ever had with the clutch hydraulics. I also thought maybe you have debris blockage in a line, a flake of rust or dirt or a soft line that's eroded into goo. Or is it possible you dented or kinked a hard line?
Are we sure you can rule out for certain it's inside the transmission yet?
You can move the clutch fork if you spin, brace yourself and go leg press day at the gym. I think it's something like 100 lbs of force.
That's one nice thing about the RA60 in my Taco (and there ain't a lot of things I like about it more than a W56). But it has an inspection plate so you can see inside the bellhousing. That would tell you a lot, that the throwout is good, no pressure plate fingers are broken, etc.
Let’s think about this some more:
- You can move through the gears just fine when the truck is stopped AND you said it was working just fine on the spooky night run so I think we can rule out the tranny.
- I know you said that both cylinders are new but I have had a bad slave cylinder right out of the box. If you see movement, it’s probably good though. But then again, it could be faulty in a way that it moves it but not enough
- Is there rod length adjustment from the pedal to the piston on the master? Or are there variations of masters year to year? I’m wondering if you’re getting enough stroke when you push the pedal? I’m not super familiar with these mini trucks but there could be variations of piston length
- Maybe flush your fluid again?
DaveInDenver
Rising Sun Ham Guru
There is a different part number for 79-83, 84-88 and 89-95 but AFAIK all clutch masters are 5/8" bore and the difference is mechanical in fit to the firewall.
I have for them:
31410-35360 (89-95)
31410-35142 (84-88)
31410-35102 (79-83)
I have for them:
31410-35360 (89-95)
31410-35142 (84-88)
31410-35102 (79-83)
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rover67
Rising Sun Member
So can you see the fork moving and it is moving through the expected travel? Sorry , not sure I am totally following.. but if the fork is moving and pressing on the clutch fully maybe the pilot bearing in the flywheel clutch blew/seized? That'd let it shift engine off but not when running..
When you got it into the garage in reverese the first time, how'd you do that? did you fire it up and use the clutch like normal then? Did it feel like it wasn't fully disengaging?
When you got it into the garage in reverese the first time, how'd you do that? did you fire it up and use the clutch like normal then? Did it feel like it wasn't fully disengaging?
FJCDan
Rising Sun Member
No inspection plate so I can’t get inside to look.
Certainly can’t rule it out.
I can see the slave moving, but it does seem like it is not moving as much as it should. When I was getting it in to the garage I had very little clutch to work with. It worked a little better when I got some more fluid in the master.
rover67
Rising Sun Member
So, I’m thinking it’s just STILL not bled and the clutch isn’t releasing. Maybe? And not to insult your bleeding skills but: When you crack the slave to bleed try it like this if you haven’t… Make sure you get your helper to press and hold pedal to the floor while you crack the slave bleed screw. If you get some movement at the slave try to keep it to one stroke of the pedal don’t pump it. Then, make sure the slave doesn’t fully retract when you open the screw just let it come back a little then close the screw. If it bled until the slave fully retracted and stopped moving on its own that’s too much. Keep doing that short stroke bleed until hopefully the last few bubbles come out. Or find or rig up a pressure bleed somehow.
And as mentioned above there’s the possibility you have a bad master out of the box that’s letting air past the seals but that should be evident when you have bubbles coming out while bleeding that never stop.
If you give the clutch pedal like a real fast pump does it work better?
These are the projects my go-to brake bleeder buddy hates the most “hey do you mind coming to the garage for ‘a few minutes’ when you get a chance, promise it’s like the last time.. it’ll work”
And as mentioned above there’s the possibility you have a bad master out of the box that’s letting air past the seals but that should be evident when you have bubbles coming out while bleeding that never stop.
If you give the clutch pedal like a real fast pump does it work better?
These are the projects my go-to brake bleeder buddy hates the most “hey do you mind coming to the garage for ‘a few minutes’ when you get a chance, promise it’s like the last time.. it’ll work”
DaveInDenver
Rising Sun Ham Guru
Finding good bleeding pedal operators is a challenge. I had to go back to a pressure bleeder tool.
FJCDan
Rising Sun Member
Update, Houston we have lift off. Thanks Dave the FSM helped out adjusted The clutch pedal to the clutch master cylinder and now have full pedal pressure and it drives great. Nice and smooth through all gears and even shifts into reverse better. My wife is happy to have her truck back again. Thanks to everyone for all the suggestions, took awhile but it’s done. Now I just need to figure out my clunking sound coming from my 4Runner. Dan
rover67
Rising Sun Member
Thats awesome news! so was the pedal hitting the floor too fast or something? Like did it need to be adjusted out?
FJCDan
Rising Sun Member
The push rod going into the master cylinder needed to be adjusted out so it would push further into the master cylinder Duh. Works great now.
FJCDan
Rising Sun Member
Been driving the truck around for a couple of days now and really shifting so much better now, should have figured something has been going wrong with it.