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Turbo swap! Should or shouldn't?
- Thread starter Squishy!
- Start date
Red_Chili
Hard Core 4+
Yep, Jeff is the king of 22R turbo setups.
Read all he has to say to figure out just how involved - and expensive - it is to get anywhere near that point. Think of getting all the basics (manifold, exhaust, etc.; you don't want the stock turbo, and that is just the beginning of the expense!) as a beginning point.
Kinda like putting a wastegate on your bank account.
Everything I read says that a blower on a 3.4 is pretty straightforward, and Gadget has debugged the right setup just like others have debugged a leaf spring SAS. It's easy now.
There ain't no easy, cheap basic equivalent with a turbo 22R. Unless you want to run 6 lbs. and just correct for altitude... but that is hardly worth the effort... and if I know you, you won't be able to leave it alone. I know *I* wouldn't be able to. And you are worse than *I* am in that regard! Or is it, better with skilz than I am?
Take yer pick!
Oh, and UB, if you met the lady you would be embarrassed at your joke...
Read all he has to say to figure out just how involved - and expensive - it is to get anywhere near that point. Think of getting all the basics (manifold, exhaust, etc.; you don't want the stock turbo, and that is just the beginning of the expense!) as a beginning point.
Kinda like putting a wastegate on your bank account.
Everything I read says that a blower on a 3.4 is pretty straightforward, and Gadget has debugged the right setup just like others have debugged a leaf spring SAS. It's easy now.
There ain't no easy, cheap basic equivalent with a turbo 22R. Unless you want to run 6 lbs. and just correct for altitude... but that is hardly worth the effort... and if I know you, you won't be able to leave it alone. I know *I* wouldn't be able to. And you are worse than *I* am in that regard! Or is it, better with skilz than I am?
Take yer pick!
Oh, and UB, if you met the lady you would be embarrassed at your joke...
wesintl
Moderator
I have a journal bearing turbo. lack of oil yes. turbo timer, not needed imho.
Red_Chili
Hard Core 4+
Yah but you got a dweasel what ain't nuttin' like a 22RTE.
wesintl
Moderator
turbo is turbo. no difference. and fwiw I have a gasser turbo on a diesel. turbo timer is to prevent coking of the oil, some lubercation but IMHO if the turbo isn't spinning it really doesn't need lub. modern oil (and really oil from 20 years ago) doesn't really have a problem with coking. EGT's are pretty much the same unless you really jack up the boost on either.
rover67
Rising Sun Member
I have run several turbo cars without turbo timers, diesels and gassers..
If you take it easy on the last few minutes of your drive the turbo cools off enough.
If you take it easy on the last few minutes of your drive the turbo cools off enough.
AxleIke
Hard Core 4+
I have no disagreement on the turbo timer aspect. More money and time, but yes, you can do it.
IMHO, its not worth it. The toy turbo stuff simply does not provide enough power to justify the effort, time, and money it takes to get it in on a NA engine.
You'll get a lot more power and "git up and go" from a 3.4 swap.
As I said, I love the turbo 4cyl's. If you've got one stock, I'm way jealous. To modify a 22re to fit the stock stuff is not worth it.
Minimal increase in power for the money.
IMHO, its not worth it. The toy turbo stuff simply does not provide enough power to justify the effort, time, and money it takes to get it in on a NA engine.
You'll get a lot more power and "git up and go" from a 3.4 swap.
As I said, I love the turbo 4cyl's. If you've got one stock, I'm way jealous. To modify a 22re to fit the stock stuff is not worth it.
Minimal increase in power for the money.
Red_Chili
Hard Core 4+
If yer gonna do it... I'd rebuild the turbo motor. Hopefully the head ain't cracked, that would make it not such a good deal. Like we talked about, that is a fair price including the tranny (assuming it is not long in the tooth) and tcase.
Ya still gotta think about starting a 401(k) or IRA though ma boy... NOW is a GREAT time to start buying equities for the long haul. You have the time horizon to retire a multimillionaire without a huge amount of pain (unless you procrastinate).
I know... boring...
having watched this thread, it seems like a case of "turbo fear/knowledge itus" Oil cooled turbos are fine. Marco and I share a history of those, as well as Wes. The situation is very similar to owning an 80 and the situation with the front diff. Once you know the situation, you just try never to overload it by pulling / stressing backwards.
My last high hp highly tweeked oil cooled turbo ran at 21 psi, with no intercooler, and was driven on the street. a little idle down at shut down worked just fine. Even my spouse could remember it.
That being said, I think I would have to say that putting a turbo on a stock motor over one that came with one stock is a pain in the buttocks.. I almost did this with my 240. It would have been much better to find a parts 240 turbo and do the swap with a re-build.
I don't think you need to have more than 6~7 psi on the street on most motors, and I think Marco is dead on. 3500 rpm and above is what makes a turbo worth it.
Plus, there's the fuel efficiency issue. A turbo when sized correctly, will not effect mileage on the highway. If you know when your turbo spools, and stay below it, you will usually see an INCREASE in fuel efficiency.
My last high hp highly tweeked oil cooled turbo ran at 21 psi, with no intercooler, and was driven on the street. a little idle down at shut down worked just fine. Even my spouse could remember it.
That being said, I think I would have to say that putting a turbo on a stock motor over one that came with one stock is a pain in the buttocks.. I almost did this with my 240. It would have been much better to find a parts 240 turbo and do the swap with a re-build.
I don't think you need to have more than 6~7 psi on the street on most motors, and I think Marco is dead on. 3500 rpm and above is what makes a turbo worth it.
Plus, there's the fuel efficiency issue. A turbo when sized correctly, will not effect mileage on the highway. If you know when your turbo spools, and stay below it, you will usually see an INCREASE in fuel efficiency.
AxleIke
Hard Core 4+
I never said the oil cooled turbo's weren't fine. Just more work.
I personally find the idling before shut down extremely annoying. Obviously, that is a personal issue.
Stock, the turbo isn't that impressive IMO. I never said that you couldn't modify it, but Squishy was talking about using stock 22re stuff, which said to me that he was on a budget. The stock stuff isn't going to produce big HP numbers.
If you go for it Justin, Best of luck to you! I'll certainly want to drool over it at a meeting sometime if you do.
wesintl
Moderator
I'm sure it can't hurt. The key is to know what the egt's are.
Back to the subject. I wouldn't buy it unless I needed all the ancillaries. Best thing to do would be to mod what you have with a garrett turbo. Parts are way more plentiful than the ct20 (or whatever it is) turbos that toyota uses on the mini. I guess that's somewhat relative working for toyota. Even so, way more customizable than the toyota route.
Back to the subject. I wouldn't buy it unless I needed all the ancillaries. Best thing to do would be to mod what you have with a garrett turbo. Parts are way more plentiful than the ct20 (or whatever it is) turbos that toyota uses on the mini. I guess that's somewhat relative working for toyota. Even so, way more customizable than the toyota route.
Squishy!
Rising Sun Member
It's an upgraded turbo, and if you use a all-trac corolla oil cooler attachment, it just bolts between the block and the oil filter. prob solved.
J-man -
IF you have all the pieces parts from this donor, and you have the skills, which I know you do, and the time, and the money, you need not rationalize it..
that being said, (dad voice on) you will get almost NO return on this investment imho. the more boring route, putting that cashola into something family prudent would be better.. (dad voice off)
damhik
IF you have all the pieces parts from this donor, and you have the skills, which I know you do, and the time, and the money, you need not rationalize it..
that being said, (dad voice on) you will get almost NO return on this investment imho. the more boring route, putting that cashola into something family prudent would be better.. (dad voice off)
damhik
Red_Chili
Hard Core 4+
+1, daMhik...