Real time FJ40 F engine help needed

[MDH33]

Hi all, doing some work on a '66-'67 FJ40 with an F engine. Took the manifold and carb off for a rebuild and because the manifold had an apparent leak.

Rebuilt the carb, cleaned up the manifold and got some new gaskets and a new carb insulator.

I'm trying to re-install the manifold and there are two studs coming from the head that go into the near and far ends of the manifolds. The rest of the manifold is held on with bolts and clamps that go into the head.

When I set the manifold in place on those two studs from the head, the holes on the intake manifold do not line up with the holes on the head. They are about 1/8 to 1/4 inch too high.

Could this be the wrong manifold for this engine that was swapped out by a PO? Anyone have pics of what the '66-'67 manifolds should look like? (one barrel carb with the three piece gasket).

Any help appreciated.

 

[wesintl]

http://www.sor.com/sor/cat044.tam?xax=29340&page.ctx=cat044.tam

I doubt it. There is no way a later intake would bolt up to a simese head. vise versa. I believe the intake rings help things line up as it gets compressed.

 

[MDH33]

Thanks for the reply Wes.

IDave on Mud replied to my post there with some pics and confirmed I have the right parts.

my immediate thought is that if you run the intake without those rings, it will heat up and warp out of shape. Which appears to be the case with this intake. The rings must serve the dual purpose of holding the gaskets in place and and also keeping the intake inline with the head.

Any way to reshape, or should I start searching for a new intake ? ...

 

[treerootCO]

As long as the intake you have is a siamese intake, it should be the correct one. There is an F120? and and F135 head and I believe they use the same manifold. Did you look at the siamese manifold that is laying by the garage? There is also one in the convertible, probably eight more in the backyard you can look at as well.

 

[MDH33]

Thanks Mike, I'll stop by and take a look. I slapped a straight edge across it and it does appear that it could be warped out of shape. The holes for the intake are actually lower than they should be, as if they sagged.

 

[MDH33]

I took some pics and posted on MUD as well. It's seeming likely that the intake manifold warped because it was run without the three rings to keep it aligned. I took some pics and you can see where the intake holes were mis-aligned.

Front

Middle

Rear

 

[wesintl]

Yeah.. THere really is nothing to keep in lined up the way it bolts down if they aren't in there. I would just slap it back on the way it was.

We really need to find a set and have repro's made at a machine shop.

 

[MDH33]

Yeah.. THere really is nothing to keep in lined up the way it bolts down if they aren't in there. I would just slap it back on the way it was.

We really need to find a set and have repro's made at a machine shop.

I was thinking of just bolting it back up, but it really looks like the intake will not be sealed because of where the gasket sits. There will actaully be a gap and huge air leak around this one:

 

[wesintl]

Spector claims to have used rings in stock. #9 and #10
http://www.sor.com/sor/cat044.tam?xax=21814&page.ctx=cat044.tam

Buy a set for me and I'll pay you when I get the soft top parts...

 

[treerootCO]

martin has the only three extras i had.

does the intake bolt to the exhaust like an f/2f?

 

[wesintl]

Yeah, but what keeps it to the head are those rocker bolts. It just keeps it against the head not really line it up.

 

[treerootCO]

I made the mistake on the 2F of clamping the intake to the exhaust before mounting the two to the head. The clamping force is enough to prevent the intake/exhaust from sealing properly. I don't have a good reference here but I was thinking those bolts might exist on the f135.

I wonder what the difference is between #9 and #10 on SOR's page is?

Does the bolt hole in the pic next to the middle runner attach to the exhaust? That would cause problems if miss alligned.

 

[MDH33]

The rings are different diameters, 9 & 10. The center ring is slightly smaller. They probably wouldn't be too difficult to replicate. I'll take detailed measurements before I install them. (Also might be able to get these replicated in titanium on the RP machine at work, I'll keep you posted) Although if I can't get a decent manifold to replace this warped one, I won't need them at all.

 

[wesintl]

Will it not bolt up with the rings? Mine was off too but got sucked/moved into place with the rings and tightening down.

 

[MDH33]

Will it not bolt up with the rings? Mine was off too but got sucked/moved into place with the rings and tightening down.

Not with the two manifolds bolted together, not even close. Maybe I'll try it with the two manifolds seperated, then bolt them together after they are in place. The worst that could happen is the rings get crushed or the manifold cracks.

 

[treerootCO]

Not with the two manifolds bolted together, not even close. Maybe I'll try it with the two manifolds seperated, then bolt them together after they are in place. The worst that could happen is the rings get crushed or the manifold cracks.

Exactly. You cannot assemble the two halves together. Loosen the bolts and once everything is positioned and tightened down, secure the two halves together. It is possible the one you have has been warped by running it that way for so long.

 

[MDH33]

Exactly. You cannot assemble the two halves together. Loosen the bolts and once everything is positioned and tightened down, secure the two halves together. It is possible the one you have has been warped by running it that way for so long.

Mike, do you have a spare set to sell? It might be worth just replacing them both since the intake is warped and the heat riser on the exhaust is siezed.

In the meantime I'll try loosening the two halves and see if will come back together.

 

[treerootCO]

I have extra everything. You know that....

 

[MDH33]

Mike and Wes,

So I took measurements of the manifold rings and the inside of manifold/head openings and created an accurate 3D file:

I'm going to see if I can replicate these in Titanium at work. The melting point of Ti is higher than steel, so I think they should be fine in the heat.

I'll make some extras if they work.


Mike, will you be around tonight so I can check out the manifold you might have? Thanks again for the help.

 

[wesintl]

Ti...That would be sweet!

I looked at my manifold last night but I didn't have a chance to post since the wife went out and I was on kid duty. WOW that's some work.

Anyway. THe manifold I have isn't great. broken studs, riser broken and it seems to be warped too,maybe just not as bad as yours...

I still have a hard time believing you can't get it to work some way(at least from looking at mine). Both of my intakes ends rest on the exhaust. Have you tried a dry bolt up without the 3 gaskets? Maybe it's the exhaust manifold that's warped and not the intake...