HAM in truck recomendations for the newbe

[Groucho]

I ran the power direct to the battery.
I suppose you could tap into the fuse panel.

One of the questions for the general exam is "Where should the radio be wired from, the battery or the vehicles fuse panel?"

The correct answer is: Directly to the battery.

While the very casual user may see no problems arise from hooking their radio to the cigarette lighter/aux power outlet, in general the accepted safe practice is to wire the radio directly to the battery (or secondary fuse block, as long as said fuse block is wired for the correct current draw of all the appliances connected to it). Keep in mind that some of these radios use upwards of 30A draw when in transmit mode. Even the ARB 32Q freezer/fridge (which may connect to the cig lighter) draws 7A constant load!

Don't try and make sense of "My CB radio was alright hooking to the vehicles fuse block, so my HAM radio will be as well." The maximum legal output of a commercially sold CB radio is 5 watts. Most of our 2M radios are between 50 and 75 watts, and the all mode (HF, VHF, UHF) radios can come ready to give 100 watts power. Maybe Dave can give us the equation for current draw at 12V and 50W power. I guarantee that the vehicles fuse block does not have any spare openings rated to the numbers you will find.

The reason this is bad for us is because too many garage mechanics half-a$* our wiring, leading to a spaghetti mess under our seats and our hood. Not only does this promote problems, it also can lead to unsafe things happening like engine fires and short circuits. I had a negative battery cable fall off of a VW and it treated the battery as a fuseable link and fried it. The battery was GONE. Melted the insides like cheese in the microwave. The idea is that if general practice is to wire everything to the battery, less problems caused by wiring messes and less chance of unsafe things happening. Ultimately, it will encourage us to be btter at our "spaghetti mess" and become more professional with our installations.

 

[Bruce Miller]

life is too short for qrp. ...turn up the power

Good for you!

 

[DaveInDenver]

Maybe Dave can give us the equation for current draw at 12V and 50W power.

This is a tech test question...

BTW, another reason to wire straight to the battery with both leads is noise immunity. If both positive and negative cables are run together and to the same power source, any EMI noise will create the same level of interference on both wires and that can be filtered easier. That's called common mode noise because it's common to both leads.

 

[chtucker]

This is a tech test question...

BTW, another reason to wire straight to the battery with both leads is noise immunity. If both positive and negative cables are run together and to the same power source, any EMI noise will create the same level of interference on both wires and that can be filtered easier. That's called common mode noise because it's common to both leads.

This is a debatable decision... Theoretically it reduces noise. Some HAM manufacturers intend for you to do this, and include fuses on the negative lead.

I think with "modern (made in the last 5 years)" radios it is not needed. If your charging system is up to the task and your engine grounds are good.

There is a theory that without fusing the negative you provide a method for short to travel through the radio.

The "experts" at Motorola do not want you to take the negative lead to the battery.... and that is what I go by... I have well into the multiple hundreds of radio installs done in everything from Harleys, Crown Vics, up to Oshkosh plow trucks... and I do them all the same. Even from the factory prewires from International Truck, the negative is just to chassis.

The quality of an newer Yaesu, Icom, Kenwood matches there commercial stuff, heck they are the same radio.

The Motorola, Tait, MA/COM, BK stuff is in a different league (and price range)

I am not supplied with the proper stuff to do installs. On the radios that are not provided with ignition sense capabilities, I really should be running radios off a relay that uses a key on ignition sense.... But as a HAM you probably are not worried about ignition sense...

I have tapped the "hot" side of mini atm fuses for a lot of radios... Typically they are 35-50 watt VHF radios... I use these

I know it ain't right.... but they aren't my vehicles... But nothing has caught fire yet

Here is some of my work:

 

[Hulk]

There's another reason to bypass any key switched connections -- so you can talk on your radio or monitor the local chatter while your rig is off and you're having lunch.

I installed an aux. fuse block that goes direct to the battery, and hooked my 7800 to that. You're going to be installing more stuff in the future: being in a club with Nakman virtually guarantees that. Might as well be prepared.

 

[farnhamstj]

I've been researching and the yaesu 7800 looks like the way to go. I like the idea of the faceplate being mountable separatly. dual band I don't quite understand yet? but I bet I will shortly after my HAM book arrives and I attend some classes next month. Reviews seem to be better than for the 2800 and 1802. there seem to be complaints about the mic on both models and I assume the mic is different for the 7800. Looks like they can be found for $230. Anything to watch out for or venders to avoid? Now I got to learn about antennas. I don't need anything as big as Nathaniel's.

 

[nakman]

... dual band I don't quite understand yet? ...

Dual band means you can listen to two channels at once. A dual band like the 8800 is almost like having two separate radios, hard wired together. So you've got the Vail repeater (Colorado Connection) on one, then the 146.460 simplex group you're running with on the other. You're in contact with the group on the trail, also listening for your friend who's running late. That's just one of the many ways to use dual band.. another is using your truck as a base station to cross band repeat, so you can be walking or sitting around with an HT yet communicate through the better rig in the truck. Or in Moab you'll have your trail run on one channel, and can monitor another trail on the other, or even scan all of them on the other channel.

When I drive around in Denver, I'll usually have 145.145 on one channel and 146.460 on the other, those being our most popular I'm bound to catch whomever else is out there. Or pop over to the weather channel on the second band for a minute or two during a run, just for grins.. lots of ways to use a dual band radio, no you don't need it but it sure is cool and I'm very glad I got one, and don't know anyone here who also has one who regrets the purchase.

 

[Convert]

I've been researching and the yaesu 7800 looks like the way to go. I like the idea of the faceplate being mountable separatly. dual band I don't quite understand yet?

The 7800 is not a true dual band like the 8800. The 7800 is dual band in the sense that it can receive/transmit on two bands ( 2 meter and 70 centimeter).The 8800 is a true dual band you can listen to two different frequencies at the same time ( two radios in one right side left side) same bands as the 7800. Hope that makes sense? If you decide on the 7800 give me a shout I may have one for sale. It would include the remote mounting kit and software ( cable required)

 

[Uncle Ben]

The 7800 is not a true dual band like the 8800. The 7800 is dual band in the sense that it can receive/transmit on two bands ( 2 meter and 70 centimeter).The 8800 is a true dual band you can listen to two different frequencies at the same time ( two radios in one right side left side) same bands as the 7800. Hope that makes sense? If you decide on the 7800 give me a shout I may have one for sale. It would include the remote mounting kit and software ( cable required)

2nds on the "7800 maybe." 40's gonna need some ears!

 

[farnhamstj]

convert you have a pm

 

[farnhamstj]

"The FT-7800R provides 50 Watts of power on the 144 Mhz band, and 40 Watts on the 430 MHz, and is designed for simplicity of operation along with high performance in the receiver section. The FT-7800R is ideal for the active Ham who has a need for simplex, repeater, or FM satellite operation on both bands, but without the complication of cross-band repeat capability, which is available on our FT-8800R and FT-8900R models."

A train leaves Chicago at 6am traveling 75mph toward Denver. Another train leaves Denver at 6:30 am traveling toward Chicago at 60mph. If the distance from Denver to Chicago is 1100miles. The trains are powered by electricity generated by an onboard flux capacitor similar to the one in Back to Future, but not identical. Each passanger paid 250 euros for the ticket. How many people are on each train and how many gigawatts will it take to get to 1984?

 

[Convert]

"The FT-7800R provides 50 Watts of power on the 144 Mhz band, and 40 Watts on the 430 MHz, and is designed for simplicity of operation along with high performance in the receiver section. The FT-7800R is ideal for the active Ham who has a need for simplex, repeater, or FM satellite operation on both bands, but without the complication of cross-band repeat capability, which is available on our FT-8800R and FT-8900R models."

A train leaves Chicago at 6am traveling 75mph toward Denver. Another train leaves Denver at 6:30 am traveling toward Chicago at 60mph. If the distance from Denver to Chicago is 1100miles. The trains are powered by electricity generated by an onboard flux capacitor similar to the one in Back to Future, but not identical. Each passanger paid 250 euros for the ticket. How many people are on each train and how many gigawatts will it take to get to 1984?

Welcome to HAM SPEAK

 

[nakman]

Dude, don't over think it, just get the 8800 you won't regret it. You can always sell it to someone if you decide it wasn't the right move, and recover most of your investment.

Dan, if you sell the 7800 what are you going to get?

 

[Convert]

Dude, don't over think it, just get the 8800 you won't regret it. You can always sell it to someone if you decide it wasn't the right move, and recover most of your investment.

Dan, if you sell the 7800 what are you going to get?

Listening to the 8800 on the 145 right now

 

[Groucho]

The only thing capable of producing that is a bolt of lightning!

A train leaves Chicago at 6am traveling 75mph toward Denver. Another train leaves Denver at 6:30 am traveling toward Chicago at 60mph. If the distance from Denver to Chicago is 1100miles. The trains are powered by electricity generated by an onboard flux capacitor similar to the one in Back to Future, but not identical. Each passanger paid 250 euros for the ticket. How many people are on each train and how many gigawatts will it take to get to 1984?

1.21 Gigawatts, of course! I can't believe I beat Dave to the answer on this one!!

Dude, don't over think it, just get the 8800 you won't regret it. You can always sell it to someone if you decide it wasn't the right move, and recover most of your investment.

What he said.

As per the pending doom of the 3rd annual HAM class will show, the 8800 has 2 VFO's, or Variable Frequency Oscillators. A variable frequency oscillator (VFO) in electronics is a oscillator with an oscillation frequency that can be electronically changed (hence, variable). It is a necessary component in any radio receiver or transmitter that works by the superheterodyne principle, and controls the frequency to which the apparatus is tuned.

Which in laymans terms? The VFO is the "gypsies" behind the tuning dial that change the frequency just like your AM/FM radio.

The 2800 and 1802 have only one and it is limited to the 2M band.

The 7800 has only one, but it can do both 2M and 70CM bands individually.

The 8800 has two. Each one can do both the 2M and 70CM bands.

The real gain of the 8800? You can monitor two frequencies at the same time, as well as some cross-band repeating using VHF to UHF or UHF to VHF in order to gain range. We'll go into that during class.

HF--High frequency which is any frequency between 1.8MHz and 29.7MHz
VHF--Very High Frequency which is defined as any frequency between 50MHz and 225Mhz (for HAM use)
UHF--Ultra High Frequecy which is defined as any frequency between 420MHz and 1300Mhz

I'm done now...

 

[Uncle Ben]

1.21 Gigawatts, of course! I can't believe I beat Dave to the answer on this one!!

Aaaaaaaa don't you mean 1.21 Gw x2?

....and assuming each tube in a case of Plutonium is 1 gram = 290 passengers on both trains combined or 145 passengers on each maybe?

 

[Groucho]

1.21 gigawatts!

 

[Uncle Ben]

1.21 gigawatts!

X 2 trains

 

[Groucho]

The two trains are not traveling to 1984, just the people on the trains. The only person on train B is Mario Vlaspardi. His mother was a well know bass singer. His father was the first person to combine spaghetti with bicarbonate of soda, thus causing and curing indigestion at the same time. The only person on train A tells me that the clause in the contract that I'm reading is the "Sanity Clause", so I tell him that you can't fool me, there ain't no Sanity Claus.

Te amo!

 

[DaveInDenver]

This is a debatable decision... Theoretically it reduces noise. Some HAM manufacturers intend for you to do this, and include fuses on the negative lead.

It's not a theory, matched length cables induce a more typically common mode noise than two unequal lengths of wire and CM noise is easier to filter. The reason after market manufacturers require it is that they can't know that everyone will pick wire routes that are parasitic-free and so equal length cables to the battery are more likely to result in lower noise installs for more people. If there's one thing they hate is 1,000 people complaining on the Internet about alternator noise on their 2m radios. So it's certainly not necessary if you are careful and know not to run parallel to EMI-inducing wires and do solid work.