For what it's worth

rocdoc

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Jul 23, 2021
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Toyota puts some pretty average tires on new vehicles and they almost all have nicknames.

"BFG Rugged Fails"
"Dun-flop AT20"
"GoodTear Wrong-ler"

The Michelin LTXs they put on some Tundras though, that's a pretty sweet tire if you're not bashing them.
Good info. I'll keep this in mind. Mine are Bridgestone duelers. Might want to add them to the list.
 

DaveInDenver

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Not on my TRD Premium. Came with Bridgestone Duelers. suitable for the mall cruiser that it actually is. But I'm working on it!
Yeah, sorry. I should have been more specific. AFAIK the 4Runner TRD Pro gets the Nittos and the Taco TRD Pro gets Wranglers ATs. The other TRD trims (like my TRD Offroad) get M+S tires. I assume mine came brand new with either of the common Dunlop or Bridgestone tires, too. Although by the time it came to me as the second owner it was already wearing BFGs.
 

Woodsman

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Batesville, Indiana
They still put those Dunlop tires on them stock? I realize that OEM tires are often really crappy (usually shorter lives) but those were shockingly bad tires. I only got about 20k out of them, which actually is a blessing, and got Michelin LTX M/S on my 2004 4Runner and I got over 100k out that set of 5 and the performance on road, especially on packed snow was stunning. I have a completely anecdotal experience with Dunlop but I will avoid them for a long time.
I've been running the same Michelin tires on my F350 and they're great . Have over 70K on them with more than half of that being towing mileage.
 

CardinalFJ60

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I've got a buddy that bought a TRD Pro 4R who said they are terrible in the winter weather - I wasn't sure how accurate that might be but then remembered he has an FJ cruiser with the BFG KO's. He says they are amazing and he compares everything directly against the BFG's now.

I have Falken Wildpeaks (third set on two vehicles) and they are pretty good. It's either discount tire, or the tires themselves but they just don't seem to balance perfectly smooth no matter what they do.

Had some Cooper AT3's that were amazing and I'll be going back to them on the next round (or get the BFGs!).
I'm looking to experiment with a trial separation from BFG ATKO2s. curious about more info on the Falken's. do you have the AT3W? I'm thinking of replacing the BFGs on the 40 with them. I'm on the roads most of the time with that and like the siping for icky snowy days around town. other than the balancing...would you get them again? what vehicles do you have them on?
 

DaveInDenver

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I'm looking to experiment with a trial separation from BFG ATKO2s. curious about more info on the Falken's. do you have the AT3W? I'm thinking of replacing the BFGs on the 40 with them. I'm on the roads most of the time with that and like the siping for icky snowy days around town. other than the balancing...would you get them again? what vehicles do you have them on?
I went from BFG KO2 to Wildpeaks AT3W. They are better on snow and ice and ride a little softer on the road. They have been fine on trails but I have my concerns with the sidewall durability. All-in-all I'd run them again.

FWIW they make them in at least two places, Taiwan (or maybe China, I forget) and here in the USA, in New York state. All four of mine are US-made in size 265/75R16 load range E.

I have Discount balance them every oil change and they do seem a bit finicky. They are wearing nice, though. Mine are 2 years old, about 15k I guess, and haven't even worn 1/32" down yet. IIRC they came with a 50k warranty, which is unusual for LT tires.

One thing I didn't expect was the treads seem to pick up and throw larger rocks than the KO2. I immediately noticed hearing bigger "thumps" on the rocker panels, as weird as that sounds.
 
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AlpineAccess

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I'm looking to experiment with a trial separation from BFG ATKO2s. curious about more info on the Falken's. do you have the AT3W? I'm thinking of replacing the BFGs on the 40 with them. I'm on the roads most of the time with that and like the siping for icky snowy days around town. other than the balancing...would you get them again? what vehicles do you have them on?
I actually realized I've had 3 sets of Falkens on three vehicles; on my 100, an FJ Cruiser, and a 2015 F150.

The balancing thing is a pretty big deal to me but if I excluded that I'd say I've been happy with them. I need to get by a non-chain shop and just shell out to get them done right instead of letting discount have so many shots at it.

I don't think they are better than KO2's or Duratracs in snow but I got around fine in that 21" of heavy stuff we had here in Loveland last spring (after making it home on the washboard ice from Frisco). I don't think I can ask more than that. I haven't had KO2's in a long time to compare but I remember the KO2's were really good in snow.

Offroad they have been very good, no complaints. When I first got them I paid close attention to tread wear off road and noticed the guys with KO2's had some "chunking" after challenging sections; whereas the Falkens seemed to hold up better with a different tread pattern. Then later I heard BFG had a quality control issue so maybe it was an isolated issue. Never a question from me on the sidewall durability - I run mine in the 16-22 PSI range depending on how hot they are when I air them down after getting off the road. If you run them at lower pressures I don't know how they would handle it with such a heavy vehicle on them.

On road they are one of the quieter AT's I've owned. I have 25k on this set and IMO they don't show it. Noise even on concrete sections of 25 at 75mph is unobtrusive. I have a set of five, and rotate the spare at 5k intervals and they are wearing very evenly.

I never "wheeled" the F150 but wanted to mention it because I towed a lot with it and it had the ecoboost which has way more power than my Toyotas have, and the tires still wore very well; albeit I rotated them religiously.

I'm not very brand loyal with tires and will buy whatever has the right performance characteristics, reliable, and is at the right price. So I suppose Falken has been in that sweet spot a few times when I was shopping, but I wouldn't swear by these tires and I wouldn't argue with anyone if they say there is a better tire out there - I'm sure there is. I'm kind of bored with the Falkens and hope in a few years when I go to shop there is a new option, they haven't made any changes to much of the AT tire lineup in a decade it feels like.
 
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DaveInDenver

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The balancing thing is a pretty big deal to me but if I excluded that I'd say I've been happy with them. I need to get by a non-chain shop and just shell out to get them done right instead of letting discount have so many shots at it.
I find making a very late in the day appointment when the store is usually slowing down helps. I'm lucky in a sense as there's only two Discounts in GJ and you get to know people, at least by face, so they don't complain when I ask them to use the Road Force balancer when they aren't busy. It's just me and the Corvette guys I suppose who are picky.
 

rocdoc

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They still put those Dunlop tires on them stock? I realize that OEM tires are often really crappy (usually shorter lives) but those were shockingly bad tires. I only got about 20k out of them, which actually is a blessing, and got Michelin LTX M/S on my 2004 4Runner and I got over 100k out that set of 5 and the performance on road, especially on packed snow was stunning. I have a completely anecdotal experience with Dunlop but I will avoid them for a long time.
Yes, that’s a blessing. I want to wear these puppies out as quickly as possible and get into something better.
 

3rdgen

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The Michelin LTX M/S is phenomenal for an all season highway tire. Quiet, great winter traction, and wear very well based on my experience. Got over 80k on 2 separate sets. One set was on an 04 4runner and the other was on a 03 Sequoia.

I personally am not the big of a fan the KO2 (E) on my 3rd gen 4runner. At 50% wear they broke real easy in slick conditions. They broke much easier than my Cooper ATPs (E) with 75% wear. But the KO2 were a little better on my 03 sequoia. Thinking the combination of weight and rubber hardness was the factor. I did manage to get about 70k out of the ATPs used mostly on the 3rd gen 4runner. They got me confidently through a blizzard with about 60% wear driving back from Breck one winter. I'd recommend the ATP and would consider the AT3 based on my experience with the ATP.
 

Inukshuk

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@rocdoc great to meet you on @jps8460's Noob Run Saturday. Whichever tires you choose I am sure you will use them well on and off road.

The Kenda Klever A/T2 were the ones on my truck. I think you have 17 inch rims and were looking at 265/70R17. Sorry if I have the size wrong. The Kenda Klever A/T2 LT265/70R17 (make sure you are shoppping "LT" (Light Truck") and not "P" (Passenger) tires, is $185 at Simple Tire (they work with local Firestone shops for install)
 

3rdGen4R

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This is what I'm looking at. Trying to decide btwn 275 and 265.
Where is the indecision about size? Also, just my opinion, but the tires you had on during the newbs run will probably be fine for the winter as the wheeling season is pretty much over by now for most people, unless you plan to go to other places like Utah, Arizona, during the winter.
 

DaveInDenver

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This is what I'm looking at. Trying to decide btwn 275 and 265.
Where is the indecision about size?
What are the exact sizes, 275/70R17 vs 265/70R17?

The differences are small enough (32.2"x10.8" vs 31.6"x10.4") that IMO it's about picking a brand, model, load range that works in whichever you can find in stock. I'd wager that you'd even find that one 265 could be actually close to the same size as another's 275 once mounted.
 

rocdoc

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What are the exact sizes, 275/70R17 vs 265/70R17?

The differences are small enough (32.2"x10.8" vs 31.6"x10.4") that IMO it's about picking a brand, model, load range that works in whichever you can find in stock. I'd wager that you'd even find that one 265 could be actually close to the same size as another's 275 once mounted.
Yeah those are the sizes. I guess there’s not a lot of difference. Not worth losing any ( more) hair over. I’ll probably stick with 265 for the initial upgrade. Also need to make sure it will fit in the garage.
 

rocdoc

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The Michelin LTX M/S is phenomenal for an all season highway tire. Quiet, great winter traction, and wear very well based on my experience. Got over 80k on 2 separate sets. One set was on an 04 4runner and the other was on a 03 Sequoia.

I personally am not the big of a fan the KO2 (E) on my 3rd gen 4runner. At 50% wear they broke real easy in slick conditions. They broke much easier than my Cooper ATPs (E) with 75% wear. But the KO2 were a little better on my 03 sequoia. Thinking the combination of weight and rubber hardness was the factor. I did manage to get about 70k out of the ATPs used mostly on the 3rd gen 4runner. They got me confidently through a blizzard with about 60% wear driving back from Breck one winter. I'd recommend the ATP and would consider the AT3 based on my experience with the ATP.
We’ll I hope I don’t get 70k out of these Bridgestone duelers. My evolving strategy is to tear them up as quickly as possible so I truly NEED new tires … taking a little bit of domestic pressure :) off the situation.
 

AlpineAccess

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We’ll I hope I don’t get 70k out of these Bridgestone duelers. My evolving strategy is to tear them up as quickly as possible so I truly NEED new tires … taking a little bit of domestic pressure :) off the situation.
Can always go with the old "I should get the new tires now, so the pair that I'm selling has enough tread to get a premium price in the used market" (y)

I think that comment qualifies me as an enabler?
 

DaveInDenver

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Can always go with the old "I should get the new tires now, so the pair that I'm selling has enough tread to get a premium price in the used market" (y)

I think that comment qualifies me as an enabler?
That only works if the family comptroller does not know the actual value of take-off stock tires is a fraction of what you really want them to be worth.

In my experience if you're lucky the stock tires usually barely offset the sales taxes on a new set and that's after dealing with all the people who want to trade you a nonfunctional hot tub for them.

Maybe literally brand new off the lot OEM tires do have a significant market value, though anything with some miles, seems better to get your use out of them.
 
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3rdgen

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I have played the "family safety" card before for justifying new tires.


Of course I substitute brakes for tires but regardless the message gets across 😁
 

DaveInDenver

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I have played the "family safety" card before for justifying new tires.


Of course I substitute brakes for tires but regardless the message gets across 😁
Or to justify the much needed "safety lift", eh @L43dean?
 

rocdoc

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Can always go with the old "I should get the new tires now, so the pair that I'm selling has enough tread to get a premium price in the used market" (y)

I think that comment qualifies me as an enabler?
I considered that strategy. Called a place in Denver that buys and sells used tires. The guy said he’d give me $60 ... for all 4!
 
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