Bill Burke Recovery Training

jps8460

Cruise Moab Committee
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A few of us spent Sportsball Weekend out in GJ in the mud and muck. Here's the skinny ........

I brought it to the Cruise Moab committee that it would be cool to have a level of advancement in the training we do with Bill. While the normal intro to trail leadership training is awesome for any level, it gets a bit repetitive for folks that have done it a few times.

So, to pilot the event, I selected a few folks that I knew had a very strong working knowledge of recovery and a couple of folks that were a on the newer side (but still had some hands on experience). The goal was to see if it was worth while to expand the program and to see if there was good benefit to it for more advanced folks.

We went to GJ this past weekend with our gloves and trucks and got dirty out in the muck with Bill.

We had some classroom training time going over various topics and gelled as a group.

Then we hit the trail and worked through some super classic and basic scenarios. After each one we had a little After Action Review (AAR) and discussed what went well and what we could have done better.

We headed back to the hotel and discussed matters of state in the hotel bar over screaming karaoke.

The next day we jumped onto the trail and discussed some advanced winching theory and discussed different pieces of recovery equipment. Coincidentally a Rav4 had gotten hung up on the trail, so we wrapped up the lunch discussion and went and recovered him. We all though it was staged by Bill lol, but it was indeed real life.

We ran through most of the typical scenarios that one comes across as a trail leader and discussed proper and efficient use of equipment.

I had a great time and learned a ton.

I think it was a total success and I hope the participants will chime in with their thoughts on how it went.

It was a very "hands on" weekend and I look forward to how we can incorporate it into our normal Cruise Moab training program.

Cheers!!
 
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Inukshuk

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Good times. There is much to learn!

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DaveInDenver

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How far up Billings did you go then Sunday? What a nice day we got finally.

Did you find the stuck RAV4 coming down from Third Flats, then? That's not unusual people not realizing the road isn't as good past the parking lot. Third Flats parking lot is where it looks like Daniel made your coffee.
 
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jps8460

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How far up Billings did you go then Sunday? What a nice day we got finally.

Did you find the stuck RAV4 coming down from Third Flats, then? That's not unusual people not realizing the road isn't as good past the parking lot. Third Flats parking lot is where it looks like Daniel made your coffee.

yep he was headed down from third flats. We looped third flats to the bangs playground and then out.
 

DaveInDenver

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yep he was headed down from third flats. We looped third flats to the bangs playground and then out.
Did you go through to Bang Canyon TH or turn around? You guys are studs.
 

jps8460

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Mendocino

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This was a great time. We saw some prehistoric sites, including this petroglyph!
Petroglyph_Bangs-Canyon.png
 

AimCOTaco

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I didn't know Jackson was using us a guinea pigs but I'm glad he did.

To me the "Advanced Recovery Course" was a huge sucess from both how I thought it went and the value to me personally.

The opportunity to run through scenarios with a vary capable group [who's ideas and input were both vast and valid] and then review the outcomes and alternative options was fantastic for my own growth in these areas.

With the amount of high quality, professionally sourced information we have about trail leadership and vehicle recovery tactics I think having a second or upper level like this is very appropriate. There is simply too much to learn and practice all at once especially when we have different baseline skill sets to begin with. I also think the size for the advanced group was just right (6-8) where a larger group size for the into course is best for getting all the basics communicated.

Ace job dudes, huge thanks to JP for setting it all up!
Awesome team building out there, I loved it all, Bill time is always a great time!
 

Stuckinthe80s

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Definitely learned a lot! This will for sure help us grow as a club and "build the bench", if you will, on having more knowledge to dip into.
 

cruiseroutfit

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I was fortunate to spend some time with training extraordinaire Bill Burke doing Advanced Recovery Training this last weekend in Grand Junction. The course was arranged by Jackson Philby from the Rising Sun 4x4 club and he attended along with a half dozen other Cruiserheads from Rising Sun. I went into the class planning to reconcile the many different forms and sources of training I’ve been involved in over the years as well as prepared to learn much more. Bill is very fluent in basic and advanced skills alike and I wanted to absorb as much as possible. Highlights for me were the many on the fly scenarios Bill presented us with. In each case our group would designate a recovery leader and said person would take charge, analyze the stuck, inventory manpower and equipment and then implement the recovery. Bill would kick off a hot-wash after action discussion following each recovery and we’d discuss what worked, what could have been better and some general tips and tricks to keep trails events moving smoothly. Great weekend (Excerpt from my post on ExpeditionUtah)

80DB8DE4-A6E9-47D3-9AA3-B38C0961C7F3.jpeg
 
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jps8460

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What did you learn that you didn't already know? Please be specific.

Technical items: using the x-loc as a belay tool. There’s always small technical tidbits from auto manufacturers he’s working with. The current one is Rivian. It’s super interesting to get a glimpse of what they do in the field to test 4wd features and prove stuff out.

Not so technical items
I do a bit of training and guiding these days. From club stuff, to press drives, to event training and trail guiding, to a quick teaching moment with a customer.

Seeing how (and discussing after) Bill sets up training scenarios for stuff like this is extremely helpful. In one of the recovery scenarios we had some weird rigging after a quick window chat, Bill said to let it play out.
The point of letting it play out was all about the learning opportunity. In the end it worked, but was far from ideal. ..... in short I learn a lot about being an instructor from watching Bill teach and that’s soft stuff, but I definitely note items in my journal.

in this class it was sort of “you’re a trail leader and now you are recovering someone on your trail ride.” He was adding info about controlling the peanut gallery etc.

oh and a cool “secret” spot with some rock art :)

I should also add a tidbit about sharpening the saw. There are always detail bits that I pickup that seem to fade away if you’re not using them. Like verbiage, or quick ways to explain things. One of the sharpen the saw items was the “Spanish burton” I’ve rigged it several times just goofing around, but i’ve never had to use it or explain how it works and why it’s a good thing to have in the quiver.
 
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60wag

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Take the X-loc to a new level with the flip-flop winch :)

 

Stuckinthe80s

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Take the X-loc to a new level with the flip-flop winch :)

No lie, this video popped in my head when we were going over the x-lock at the training!
 

krice118

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I have a recovery question:

So if you have a winch on Vehcle A and want to pull a stuck vehicle, B: How can you use a snatch block to lighten the load on the winch? do you use 2 snatch blocks - one on Vehicle B and then back to A and end with the Hook on B?

Assuming a straight line pull to pull B over an obstacle.
 

DaveInDenver

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If you want to halve the work the winch is doing put the sheave on vehicle B in your scenario and connect the winch line back to the vehicle with the winch.

91ca252dfcf55c4e0d8b2b8b24384462.jpg
winchdiagrams_mid.jpg


Notice though that the winch will still be capable of the full amount of force and the thing to watch is the point with the block in this case could actually see 2x that, so you need to do stuck analysis and consider safety, such as the recovery point strength and the need to use a bridle.

winching_p1.png
 
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