Brahma's Saginaw/FJ60 Power Steering Conversion

[wesintl]

I don't even have a steering damper on my spring over 40 with 60 ps. You don't really need it.

[PabloCruise]

Matt, the Pig does not have a steering damper either (60 series PS) - no shimmies...

[Hulk]

Yeah, I think I killed my steering damper when I did the saginaw ps -- I'll have to look to be sure. It's been a while, and I tend to forget project details within days of completion.

[belaw]

Matt:

TJ referred me to this writeup, and I'm hoping you can give me some more details about how you went about sleeving the frame. In particular, I'm curious about how you went about drilling the holes for your bolt pattern? I gather that you first drilled to 1/2" and then, after dry-fitting everything, bored them up to 11/16"- correct? Did you bore both sides of the frame out to 11/16" or just the outside? I guess I'm asking do the sleeves pass all the way through the frame, or are they just welded on the outside? Also, how did you go about reaming the 3/8 schedule 80 pipe to 1/2"- did you use a lathe or drill press (I only have a drill press is why I'm asking)?

Any guidance you can provide will be greatly appreciated; there just isn't much information out there on sleeving a frame.

Another question: you mentioned that you couldn't use straightened F250 shock towers because they interfered with the steering shaft. Was the problem because of the size of the u-joint? I'm planning on using a lower profile u-joint (borgeson or wildwood), and was wondering if that would allow me to use straightened towers.

Brian

[subzali]

Originally Posted by belaw

Matt:

TJ referred me to this writeup, and I'm hoping you can give me some more details about how you went about sleeving the frame. In particular, I'm curious about how you went about drilling the holes for your bolt pattern?

There are several ways to get the holes drilled in the frame. The easiest way would be to get a 12mm (15/32" I think) transfer punch, and once you have the steering box located where you want on the frame use the transfer punch to locate your holes. Then drill them out to whatever size you want and use a transfer punch that matches that size hole to punch the back side of the frame and through-drill the holes.

Originally Posted by belaw

I gather that you first drilled to 1/2" and then, after dry-fitting everything, bored them up to 11/16"- correct?

Yes but if you have the pipe bored out you could just drill it up to the 11/16" size and do the dry fit that way. Or you can drill it to M12 and do the dry fit that way. Your choice, it's kinda hard to know what exactly is the right way to do it until you're there in the middle of it.

Originally Posted by belaw

Did you bore both sides of the frame out to 11/16" or just the outside? I guess I'm asking do the sleeves pass all the way through the frame, or are they just welded on the outside?

Ideally the sleeve would be welded on both sides of the frame. But I think if you butted the sleeve to the inside of the frame and then welded the opposite side it would in essence have the same effect. Maybe somebody else could comment on this. Welded on both sides is best as long as you can keep everything square.

Originally Posted by belaw

Also, how did you go about reaming the 3/8 schedule 80 pipe to 1/2"- did you use a lathe or drill press (I only have a drill press is why I'm asking)?

I had to get creative with many things on this project; whatever works for you is really the best. Again, a lathe would be ideal, but if you can find a way to secure it in a drill press then that would be good too. Realistically, there is enough warping when you're welding that things might not end up in perfect alignment anyway and you might have to take a reaming bit to open up the sleeves just a tad on one side or the other anyway. Also, the bolts that hold the box on are 12mm, not 1/2", so that's what I bored the sleeves to. I started with 1/2" on the frame because that's the only bit I had at the time that was about the right size.

Originally Posted by belaw

Any guidance you can provide will be greatly appreciated; there just isn't much information out there on sleeving a frame.

Another question: you mentioned that you couldn't use straightened F250 shock towers because they interfered with the steering shaft. Was the problem because of the size of the u-joint? I'm planning on using a lower profile u-joint (borgeson or wildwood), and was wondering if that would allow me to use straightened towers.

Brian

I'm no metal fabricator, really, so there are probably many many ways this could have been done. My limitation was that I don't know how to make good welds, so a lot of the final fitting and welding of the sleeves etc. was being done on the welder's time, so I didn't have time to figure out the optimum way to do it; I had his input and we figured out the best way we thought would work and give me what I wanted. I'm sure there are a lot of other guys on this forum who have advice on a better way it could have been done, or they have a better knowledge of the tools of the trade so they could provide input there too.

Yes, the intermediate shaft u-joint was large enough that it was hitting the shock tower. But also the steering box input is large enough that it overhangs the frame a bit on the outside, so even with a smaller u-joint I don't think a straight shock tower will sit flush on the frame on that side without a spacer. You'll just have to mock it up and see. Just make sure that the input shaft is sitting up just a tad from your frame; I have a couple posts/pictures showing that I almost messed that up quite a bit by having it too low.

Hope that helps, a lot of the how-tos are hard to explain and are probably better left to your judgment once you're in the middle of it, so you can come up with a solution that will work for you.

[subzali]

Couple updates:
getting ready for my wedding in September is keeping me pretty busy and I'm watching my pennies. Jacki and I are also taking Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University, so I am really watching it because it sounds pretty cool to be debt-free, and it won't be that hard for us because we're young. Also since I got the Tundra things have been a little bumpy just getting that all in order (with the red truck and everything too). So I haven't really had a chance to do much to the Cruiser. I need to address some electrical issues (headlights, instrument panel, etc.) before I will let myself do too many other mods - even though I've got two on the back burner that I would really like to get done (OBA and aux fuel tank). Anyway I cleaned out my dad's barn of a lot of parts that were swapped out for this conversion, I'm sure he appreciated that (it's good to purge once in a while).

Anyway, I took it out on Argentine a couple weeks ago and am loving it! Driving on the road is a lot more enjoyable (I think my vibrations are down some), and the trails are PLENTY more enjoyable as well! Doing one-handed u-turns over rocks, driving over boulders and not having the wheel pull from my hand, every part of it is amazing!

I'm still not running a steering stabilizer, and after thinking about the comments above some more and reading on MUD a little bit, and after driving it and seeing how it has done, I am thinking it's ok to leave it off for now. I think I would feel like the conversion is more "complete" if I got one on, but I will save that for a day when I don't have a bunch of other things to do.

I also would still like to install a cooler, but again same issue as before. The steering wheel is a little closer to me than I would prefer as well, but it wouldn't be hard for a fabricator to cut it down some, or I could put in some seats that sit up higher and further back. Just all part of the process and the evolution.

I also found out that Poser and others on MUD, who sell the kits for the Saginaw conversions, also sell sleeves (and I'm assuming instructions) for how to sleeve the frame properly so everything lines up. I haven't looked into it any further, but for someone who is contemplating that just know the information is out there. I don't know if that would have helped with my conversion though; what would have made mine a LOT easier would have been to remove the engine so I could drill the frame from both sides and mark exactly on both sides where I wanted the holes to be. But I was able to figure it out without doing that and it's fine.

Anyway, very happy with the conversion, after driving it for a bit, and would say it is very well worth the time, money, and effort!

[corsair23]

Originally Posted by subzali

The steering wheel is a little closer to me than I would prefer as well, but it wouldn't be hard for a fabricator to cut it down some, or I could put in some seats that sit up higher and further back. Just all part of the process and the evolution.

How about a smaller steering wheel? You still have the OEM steering wheel? With PS you don't need that big wheel anymore

I know they are OEM but the Grant wheels are pretty nice. I installed one of the security dealyos as well that allows you to remove the steering wheel - Anyway, the smaller diameter steering wheel really seems to open up some space.

[AxleIke]

Awesome work Matt! Very cool thread. I love the detail, and attention to little stuff.

[subzali]

Originally Posted by corsair23

How about a smaller steering wheel?

for some reason that option doesn't appeal to me as much as modifying the steering column or getting some heated seats that sit a little higher and further back

I guess I like the look and feel of a stock cockpit, at least for now.

[PabloCruise]

Great recap Matt!

I like the stock wheel as wheel. It keeps things looking stock...